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    Hadith- infertile women

    Allah’s Messenger (SAW) also encouraged people to choose the young and fertile. On this subject, Mu’qal bin Yasar related that a man said to Allah’s Messenger (SAW):

    "I found a beautiful woman from a noble family but she cannot bear children, should I marry her? Allah’s Messenger (SAW) replied, "Nay." The man came back and asked a third time and asked the same question, Allah’s Messenger (SAW) turned to his companions and said: "Choose in your wives the fertile and the affectionate, for I shall take pride in your number on the day of judgment."

    Can anyone confirm this hadith as authentic?

    So, what is the deal with women who can't have children? They were created like that, so men shouldn't marry them?

    I dont get this hadith, it seems inauthentic, since women who can't conceive can certainly adopt children and raise the orphans as good muslims and also since it isn't in the power of a woman to change her fertility.
    I believe in dragons, good men, and other fantasy creatures.

    #2
    "I found a beautiful woman from a noble family but she cannot bear children, should I marry her?
    Ibrahim says : salaams to all

    what this hadith conveys and means is that the noble/beautiful woman is attaching a precondition that she will NOT bear children, if anyone wants to marry her. NO women will know whether she can bear children or not at that time frame which is in the control Of Allah (swt) alone, so when we read hadiths we need to think rationally based on prevailing conditions of that time frame.

    Allah’s Messenger (SAW) replied, "Nay." The man came back and asked a third time and asked the same question, Allah’s Messenger (SAW) turned to his companions and said: "Choose in your wives the fertile and the affectionate, for I shall take pride in your number on the day of judgment."
    Ibrahim says : what the Prophet (pbuh) conveyed is that it is better to chose a women that does not attach such preconditions in marriage, and will be able to act as a mother as well as a being an affectionate wife and life is incomplete when one marries for lust or beauty without ever becoming a parent to truly understand life as well as have children who will take care of the parents as they become old. .

    So, what is the deal with women who can't have children? They were created like that, so men shouldn't marry them?
    Ibrahim says apparently you did not THINK rationally , when you read the hadith , for it says no such thing.

    Hope that helps

    Ibrahim

    Marriage is not gazing at each other but looking together in the same direction and creating a household that is beneficial to this planet in the cause of Allah (swt)

    Comment


      #3
      Ibrahim, you have raised an excellent point that at the time period, no woman could know if she was infertile or not...although, this would need confirmation, because perhaps the woman is a widow or divorcee, and knows she is infertile because she's already tried.

      Also, you must keep in mind that people were not totally unaware of science at the time period. Obviously, if a woman has amenstruation, or NO menstruation, then she cannot conceive. This is apparent before marriage. Perhaps the woman faced this problem?

      Furthermore, the hadith uses the word "fertile". This has nothing to do with whether a woman wants to bear a child or not. This becomes a physical issue. The hadith instructs men to marry FERTILE women, not women WILLING to have children or not. Obviously, muslim women should be prepared to give birth, although its not a MUST. You can always adopt if you chose not to go thru the pain of having a child, although that would take a lot of planning, since birth control methods are discouraged Islamically.

      Also the Hadith states that the young man told the prophet that this woman CANNOT have children, not that she WILL NOT have children. There is a difference between can/cannot and will/will not.

      Thus, this hadith is entirely and only based upon fertility, and not on the woman's choice in having or not having a child.

      So Ibrahim bhai, you see, I did use rational thinking before posting up this hadith for discussion.
      I believe in dragons, good men, and other fantasy creatures.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by PyariCgudia:
        Ibrahim says: salaams to all

        Dear PyariCgudia, Not everybody can understand scripture and the Creator himself made that Clear.

        Kindly read and contemplate on it.


        3:7 He it is Who has sent down to thee the Book: in it are verses basic or fundamental (of established meaning); they are the foundation of the Book: others are allegorical. But those in whose hearts is perversity follow the part thereof that is allegorical seeking discord and searching for its hidden meanings but no one knows its hidden meanings except Allah and those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say: "We believe in the Book; the whole of it is from our Lord"; and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.


        Your problem seems to be lack of overall knowledge and you seem to want to talk based on what you THINK, rather than what is being implied in the hadith.

        1) No Prophet delivered a message where it was instructed that men should only marry fertile women ( meaning there was no need for any men to ask the Prophet permission to marry as this hadith shows)

        2) The hadith you quote conveyed the men repeatedly asked for permission because he had a desire and that desire was in conflict with what the noble women is requesting ( meaning because she is noble and beautiful, she does not want to bear children is her condition which that men has problems accepting, hence he is approaching the Prophet (pbuh) concerning it.)

        3) Read what the original hadith says:

        Sunan of Abu-Dawood Hadith 2045 Narrated by Ma'qil ibn Yasar


        A man came to the Prophet (peace be upon him) and said: I have found a woman of rank and beauty, but she does not give birth to children. Should I marry her? He said: No. He came again to him, but he prohibited him. He came to him third time, and he (the Prophet) said: Marry women who are loving and very prolific, for I shall outnumber the peoples by you.

        Now IF you want to argue kindly quote proper source for your quote.


        Now I do not wish to argue based on what you THINK, But make it CLEAR to you understanding scriptures is based on collective knowledge and not based on one or few hadiths or verses from the Qur’an.

        Was salaam
        Ibrahim

        Comment


          #5
          http://www.themodernreligion.com/misc/sex/sex_good.htm

          This website, Ibrahim bhai, was posted in the corner room under the post title Marital Rape -- I perused it and this is where the hadith I've posted up was found.

          I dont know which one is the correct version - but it certainly would seem to me that the version you've put up is the correct one. When I read this hadith, it bothered me, since I didn't think that the Prophet would say such a thing since he himself married women who were widows and already had children, and he married many who weren't young, like Khadija. So the "young and fertile" had me wondering, if this would be an authentic hadith or not.

          But since you've posted up this other version of the hadith, then am I to take it that childbirth is mandatory upon all women? I mean, can a woman get married and opt to adopt orphans and avoid childbirth if she can?
          I believe in dragons, good men, and other fantasy creatures.

          Comment


            #6
            I dunno much abt it...but i hv read that adoption is not allowed in Islam.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by enchanted:
              I dunno much abt it...but i hv read that adoption is not allowed in Islam.
              I would like to know more about your reason for holding this belief. Strange because the Quran asks us to help the Orphans, and the Prophet(PBUH) himself had an adopted son(I think).

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by PyariCgudia:
                then am I to take it that childbirth is mandatory upon all women?
                Ibrahim says: Salaams to all

                Dear sister,

                Haven’t you observed that you had been made special, meaning only women have certain features that man will not have, only they alone come equipped with eggs and only they alone can bear children.

                Thus women are designed by Allah (swt) as mothers , but that does not mean all women will be mothers in their lifetime, some will beg and cry to become mothers and others may hate to become mothers and yet others full of love and joy on becoming mothers.


                All of which are meant to be a trial for mankind.

                Kindly read and contemplate on:-

                42:49 To Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth. He creates what He wills (and plans). He bestows (children) male or female according to His Will (and Plan).

                50 Or He bestows both males and females and He leaves barren whom He will: for He is Full of knowledge and power.


                I mean, can a woman get married and opt to adopt orphans and avoid childbirth if she can?
                Ibrahim says: a women who prohibits what Allah (swt) had enjoined would have a serious problem with Allah (swt), don’t you think so?

                17:31 Kill not your children for fear of want: We shall provide sustenance for them as well as for you: verily the killing of them is a great sin

                I mean, she comes equipped with eggs and she gets married and starts a household where her partner comes equipped with what is needed to fertilize her eggs (in order to create others like them ), Eventually the two will grow old and at one point in time they will need people to look after them, who will do that for them?, if they had no children from their own lineage?

                Now here you wish to overcome this by adopting a child and raising it as your own. Obviously, by giving security and guidance to an orphan, you may be doing a good deed on the other hand you must understand that you were only a “custodian for that child” or a foster parent and NEVER his/her natural mother.

                Children “looked after” ( adopted in the English sense) in this way, are not legally, socially and morally your children. You are in no way permitted to allow the child to think you are his/her mother, nor are you allowed to attach your name or surname to the child.

                Why?

                Because : such children are not your blood relations and have no obligations as a son or daughter has towards their natural parents as the parents have towards them, in the decree of Allah (swt)

                58:2 If any men among you divorce their wives by Zihar (calling them mothers) they cannot be their mothers: none can be their mothers except those who gave them birth. And in fact they use words (both) iniquitous and false: but truly Allah is one that blots out (sins) and forgives (again and again).

                Because

                8:75 And those who accept faith subsequently and adopt exile and fight for the faith in your company they are of you. But kindred by blood have prior rights against each other in the Book of Allah. Verily Allah is well acquainted with all things.

                33:6 The Prophet is closer to the Believers than their own selves and his wives are their mothers. Blood-relations among each other have closer personal ties in the Decree of Allah than (the Brotherhood of) Believers and Muhajirs: nevertheless do ye what is just to your closest friends: such is the writing in the Decree (of Allah)


                Have you not heard of the Prophet who cried for children and his wife finally found another wife for him, Jealousy broke them apart and eventually to be given a child of her own , which she was NEVER able to have in her youth?

                Hope that helps

                Was salaam
                Ibrahim

                you cannot break the laws of nature, you can only break yourself against them.


                Comment


                  #9
                  help me understand these ayahs you've posted up Ibrahim.

                  Am I to take it in any way, that you aren't to treat your foster child equal to your real child. Like for example, I take my child out to lunch after he get's str8 A's, I pay for his college education and send him to the best university, I give him a monetary allowance, I buy him a car, I look hard to find a great rishtaa for him or allow him to chose his own, etc.

                  Am I to treat my adopted child any less in these ways? Am I to show my adopted child that I favor my real child?

                  To answer my own question, I dont see anything in these ayahs to tell me I would have to treat my adopted "son or daughter" in a inferior manner. But your argument gives me a slight impression of that. I hope I've misunderstood.

                  I think what the Quran is trying to get at is that biologically, you can't consider your adopted child equal to a real child. For example, if I gave birth to a son, and for some reason, I chose to adopt a daughter, there is no reason for me to object or be surprised if the two children grow up and then fall in love and then wish to be married. Even though I thought of them both as children, and it might seem awkward to many cultures since adopted children are raised thinking they have no right to like their biologically unrelated siblings, there is Islamically nothing wrong in such a situation, because in the end, the two siblings really are not related by blood.

                  Likewise, if for some weird reason, I decide to adopt a child right now being 19 years old, and this kid is like 10 years old, then there is no reason for me to be surprised when I'm 29 and he's 20 that he decides one day to propose to me, even though I'd be raising him like a son.

                  I hope that didn't sound too weird. I know that to many who aren't muslims, it may.

                  Do you agree with my thoughts on the matter, Ibrahim? Do you think I've interpreted these ayahs correctly?
                  I believe in dragons, good men, and other fantasy creatures.

                  Comment


                    #10

                    Question:
                    I would like to know if mulsims can adopt children?
                    Answer:
                    Dear Sr. A. As-salaamu alaykum. Adoption in Islam (where the biological parents' real identity is concealed and the caring parents identify themselves as the birth parents of the adopted child) is prohibited in Islam. However, fostering a child is allowed. Fostering means that a child lives with you but he/she knows that you are not the biological parent. Also, supporting orphans is highly recommended in Islam. Therefore, you may foster and support children but not adopt them. Thank you for asking and God knows best.

                    Question:
                    Adoption is forbidden in Islam. But according to authentic Hadiths related by Al-Bukhari, the Prophet adopted a son named Zaid. Please comment.
                    Answer:
                    Both statements of the prohibition of adoption in Islam and the Prophet's adoption of Zaid are correct. The explanation of these two apparently contradictory facts lies in their chronological order. Zaid ibn Harithah was a young child when he was kidnapped by fighters who raided the living quarters of his tribe when their men were out on their business. Zaid was sold as a slave and he ended up in Makkah when he was given as a gift by her uncle to Khadeejah, who later was married to Muhammad, her third husband. At that time, he was 25 years of age. Lady Khadeejah was a rich woman who married Muhammad, having learned much about his character which filled her with admiration. At that time, Muhammad was being carefully prepared by Allah for his forthcoming mission as the last prophet to be sent to mankind. Needless to say, neither he nor Khadeejah knew anything at that time. Prophet-hood came 15 years after his marriage. Khadeejah made a gift of Zaid to her husband so that he would have a good servant. Zaid's father was full of grief when he learned of what had happened to his son. He tried hard to find out where he was carried to. Perhaps, it was a few years before he learned that Zaid was in Makkah, a slave in one of its most distinguished households. He, therefore, traveled with his brother hoping to buy his son's freedom. When they spoke to Muhammad about Zaid, they requested him to agree to sell Zaid back to them and to accept a reasonable price for him. He made them a different offer saying: "I will charge you nothing. If he prefers to stay with me, I will not part with anyone who prefers my company." They said: "This is indeed a very reasonable offer." When Zaid was called in, Muhammad asked him whether he recognized the two men. On receiving an affirmative answer, Muhammad offered him the choice of going back or staying with him. Unhesitatingly, Zaid chose to stay with Muhammad saying to his father and his uncle, "I have seen things of this man which make me keen never to part with him." When Zaid made his choice, Muhammad took him by the hand and went to the Ka'aba where he addressed the people present saying to them: "Bear witness that I have adopted Zaid as a son who will inherit me and I will inherit him." Zaid's father was gratified and he went back home with his brother. This is how the adoption of Zaid by the Prophet came to pass, long before he became a prophet. Ever since that day, Zaid was called in Makkah and everywhere else as "Zaid ibn Muhammad." This continued to be the case throughout the 13 years during which the Prophet preached his message in Makkah and in the early years of his stay in Madinah. It was later that the verses of the Qur'an which speak of adoption were revealed. These make it clear that adoption is prohibited and that every adopted son or daughter must be called after his or her real father. This automatically abrogated the adoption of Zaid who reverted to his original name, Zaid ibn Harithah, in compliance with Allah's orders. The Prophet was very kind to Zaid through their association. He arranged Zaid's marriage to his own wet nurse Umm Ayman who gave birth to Zaid's son Ussamah, whom the Prophet loved very dearly. Later on, the Prophet married Zaid to his own cousin, Lady Zainab, who only accepted the marriage to please the Prophet. The marriage was an unhappy one and Zaid reluctantly divorced Zainab. The seal on the prohibition was placed by Allah Himself when He instructed the Prophet to marry Zainab. Thus, the Prophet demonstrated practically the nullification of all adoption. Had adoption been of any significance, it would not have been possible that the Prophet marries a former wife of his former adopted son. The fact that the marriage took place and was specifically ordered by Allah left no doubt whatsoever that adoption is totally forbidden in Islam.
                    Source:
                    Arab News
                    Hope they answer ur queries Mahiwal

                    Comment


                      #11
                      "O people ! Muhammad has no sons among ye men, but verily, he is the Apostle of God and the last in the line of Prophets. And God is Aware of everything." (Surah Al Ahzab: 40)

                      This verse has been revealed in the fifth Ruku' (para or passage) of Surah al-Ahzab. In this Ruku' Allah has provided answers to all those objections raised by the hypocrites, which had given rise to a storm of calumnies, slander and mischief in respect of the marriage of Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) with Hadrat Zainab (may Allah be pleased with her).

                      These hypocrites argued that Zainab was the wife of an adopted son of the Holy Prophet and by this connection she stood in the position of the Prophet's daughter in-law. Hence, after her divorce from Zaid, the Prophet had taken his own daughter-in-law as wife.

                      In order to refute this allegation Allah told clearly in verse 37 that this marriage had Divine sanction behind it and was made to serve as a lawful precedent for Muslim men to marry the wives of their adopted sons after they had been divorced by their husbands. Later in verses 38 and 39, Allah affirmed that no power could hinder the Prophet from discharging a Divine obligation. The Prophets are ordained to fear God, not the people. It has been an invariable practice of the Apostles to transmit the Divine message without any extraneous care and to perform the duties enjoined upon them by Allah without fear or hesitation. Afterwards a verse was revealed which extinguished the basis of all objections. In the first place, they had charged "You have taken your daughter-in-law as wife, in contravention of your own law that the wife of a son is forbidden to his father."

                      In refutation of this charge it was affirmed by the Almighty:

                      "Muhammad had no sons among ye men..."

                      thereby making absolutely clear that the man whose divorced wife was taken into wedlock by the Prophet being not his real son; the act, therefore did not imply violation of it.

                      ~S. Abul A'la Maududi

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Adoption in Islam
                        Adoption is one of the most common options for infertile couples. Many are too quick to say that adotion is haram, when in fact the reality is that Allah on many occasions calls for Muslims to take care of orphans:

                        It is not piety that you turn your faces towards the east or west; but piety is the one who believes in Allah, the last day, the angels, the book, the Prophets, and gives his wealth, in spite of love for it, to the kinsfolk, to the orphans, and to the poor who beg, and to the wayfarer, and to those who ask... (2:177)

                        They ask you what they should spend. Say: whatever you spend of good must be for parents and kindred and orphans and the poor who beg and the wayfarers, and whatever you do of good deeds, truly Allah knows it well. (2:215)

                        Worship Allah and join none with Him in worship, and do good to parents, kinsfolk, orphans, the poor who beg, the neighbor who is near of the kin, the neighbour who is a stranger, the companion by your side, the wayfarer, and those whom your right hand possess. Verily Allah does not like such as are proud and boastful (4:36)

                        The prophet himself was an Orphan:

                        And did He (Allah) not find you (Muhammad) an orphan and gave you a refuge? And he found you unaware and guided you? And He found you poor and made you rich? Therefore treat not the orphan with oppression (94:6-9)

                        What Islam does in the case of adoption, as well as in other things, is regulate the practice and correct what is wrong. In adoption before the restrictions were made it was much like the system of adoption that is known to most of us now. Where a child assumes the identity of an actual biological child of the adopters. Assuming all rights as a child proceeding from the couple naturally. The childrens names would be changed to the family name of the adopters, inheritance would result as in the case of a natural child and the natural parents and family of the adopted would be cut off from the child. Barriers of marriage would be assumed and non-related people would walk around in a relaxed way as if they are related.

                        This was the case of Zayd the adopted son of Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.) Zayd was captured as a child during a raid, which was a norm before Islam. Khadija's nephew had brought him to her, and after she married Muhammad (s.a.w) she gave Zayd to him. At some point Zayd's actual family found out where Zayd was and went to Muhammad (s.a.w) to demand Zayds return.

                        Zayd was given a choice and Zayd chose to stay with Muhammad(s.a.w), it was after this that Zayd was adopted and became known as Zayd Ibn (son of) Muhammad.

                        Zayd was one of the first to accept Islam. Muhammad (s.a.w.) arranged a marriage between Zayd and Zaynab bint Jash, the Prophet's cousin. This marriage was not a happy one, because Zaynab treated Zayd as if he was still a slave. Zayd came to Muhammad (s.a.w) on several occasions voicing his unhappiness, but Muhammad (s.a.w) advised him to stay in the marriage.
                        Than Allah decreed the following:

                        ...Nor has He made your adopted sons your (real) sons; that is simply a saying of your mouths. But Allah speaks the truth and guides you to the (right way). Call them by their fathers names, that is more just in the sight of Allah. But if you do not know their fathers, they are your brothers in faith and your ward...(33:4-5)

                        It was after this revelation that Zayd was no longer known as Zayd ibn Muhammad. But was given the proper name; Zayd ibn Harithah. Yusuf Al Qardawi says of the above verse:
                        Let us ponder the Qur'anic words "He has not made your adopted sons your (real) sons: that is simply a saying of your mouths" This signifies that the declaration of the adoption consists of words having no corresponding objective reality. A mere pronouncement does not change realities, alter facts, or make a stranger a relative, or an adopted individual a son. A mere verbal expression or figure of speech cannot make the blood of a man runs in the veins for the adopted son, produce feelings of fatherly affection in the man's heart or filial emotions in the heart of the boy, or transfer either the genetic characteristics or physical, mental, or psychological traits.
                        Then came a huge step that would not only shatter the taboos of the jahaliyya but also the taboos of today. Allah decreed:

                        And when thou didst say to him who had recieved the favor of Allah and they favor. Retain thy wife and fear Allah thou didst hid within thy self what Allah was made about to manifest; thou didst fear the people, but it is more fitting that thou shouldst fear Allah. Then when Zayd had dissolved (his marriage) with her, with the necessary (formality). We joined her in marriage to thee in order that (in future) there may be no difficulty to the believers in marriage with the wives of their adopted sons, when the latter have dissolved with the necessary (formaility) with them. And Allah's command must be fulfilled (33:37)

                        After this revelation, the marriage between Muhammad (s.a.w.) and Zaynab was completed. The lead of the Prophet (s.a.w) was once again established in the abolishment of old practices. Enemies of Islam have in the past and presently harped on this issue of the Prophet's (s.a.w) life, because they still remain practicing the ways of Jahilliyah. It is hard for many to comprehend how such a marriage can take place when the wrongly establish boundaries that do not exist. Although a marriage between a father and his son's ex-wife is forbidden in Islam, adopted sons are not true sons. They do not hold the same blood line as true biological children. Once people begin to understand this fact, it will be easier for them to comprehend the allowance of a marriage between an ex-wife of one's adopted son.
                        In Islam inheritance has been stricly laid out, so as to avoid family arguments and battles over money and properties of the deceased. Unfortunately the greed of people causes disruption in such matters. By promoting peace and strong ties within the family Islam has settled the dispute forever. Allah says:

                        Allah directs you as regards your children's (inheritance) to the male, a portion equal to that of two females: if only daughters, two or more, their share is two thirds of the inheritance; if only one her share is half (4:11)

                        Our intent here is not to get into the reasons of why one gender's inheritence is more then anothers, but rather the specifications of inheritance. As we have seen already the Qur'an is clear that those whom you adopt are not your true children, this is something that your mouth says. So in regards to inheritance, an adopted child will not inherit the amounts of one's natural children. This will automatically cut out any jealousy on behalf of any of those involved. What can be done, however, is that 1/3 of one's assests can be divided as one chooses, so an adopted child could have this portion of inheritance, but no more can be given because it would upset the balance of what is to be divided and how.
                        One would start to wonder exactly how an adopted child would live in the household. Seeing that it is not one's child so the natural limitations are not imposed, so must be other issues such as covering. It is an established practice of muslim women to cover, per Qur'anic order. Women are to cover in front of everyone except for the following:

                        ...their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husband's sons, their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sisters sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands posses, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex...(24:31)

                        As soon as a child attains maturity, female children are to cover their bodies in such a way as perscribed in Qur'an in front of everyone except for the exceptions given. So if a couple brings an orphan in to their homes, say a male child, as soon as this male child reaches maturity every mature woman in the house would have to cover in front of him. For he is not Mahram (someone with whom marriage is forbidden, or is in a marriage with) and is to be treated as such. No female in the household is to be alone with him, and this includes the woman who is raising him. It makes for a very awkward situation to say the least. Unless a family is set up with a home which can seclude one section of the house from another, it may pose as a problem for many to say the least.
                        While discussing adoption with musilms the usual comment arises "this is the nineties, we don't have to cover nor do we have to be so strict when raising orphans." I am not about to debate the ordinance of proper covering at this point, inshallah another time and place. But Islamic standards do not change with time. Allah has simply put it

                        "It is (Qur'an) nothing but a remeinder fo all mankind" (12:103)

                        RESOURCES:
                        Quran translation by Yusuf Ali
                        The Lawful and the Prohibited in Islam by Yusuf Al Qardawi
                        La Leche League-Breast feeding support and education
                        Bukhari Sahih translated by Dr. Muhammad Khan
                        Maliks Muwatta translated by F. Amira Mataraji

                        [This message has been edited by google (edited July 05, 2002).]

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Ibrahim says: salaams to all

                          Dear sister,


                          Blood-relationship and its rights and duties do not depend on special circumstances of a temporary nature. Foster parenting is of a temporary nature. And foster/adopted children under your care will not have the same rights when it comes to inheritances under Islamic law. Nor will they have rights over natural children of that family.

                          Most of all there is an invisible bond and attachment between natural parent and their own children, when they are living together, which will not exist in foster/adopted parenting because the child will have the desire sooner or later to know his/her own parent or have some ill will against them for deserting him/her.

                          Have you not seen or heard of people trying their best to trace their natural parents as they grow older?

                          Fundamentally a child can have ONLY one father and one mother , which cannot be replaced by a foster parent or a guardian in the decree of Allah (swt) .

                          That is why the notion of reincarnation amounts to folly. Each soul can have only one parentage at anytime, here and in the hereafter they will be called by their fathers name .

                          33:4 Allah has not made for any man two hearts in his (one) body: nor has He made your wives whom ye divorce by Zihar your mothers: nor has He made your adopted sons your sons. Such is (only) your (manner of) speech by your mouths. But Allah tells (you) the Truth and He shows the (right) Way.

                          5 Call them by (the names) of their fathers: that is juster in the sight of Allah but if ye know not their father's (names call them) your Brothers in faith or your Maulas. But there is no blame on you if ye make a mistake therein: (what counts is) the intention of your hearts: and Allah is Oft-Returning Most Merciful.


                          Ibrahim says: Your notions are not found in the ayah I quoted earlier but has already been conveyed as:

                          2:233 The mothers shall give suck to their offspring for two whole years if the father desires to complete the term. But he shall bear the cost of their food and clothing on equitable terms. No soul shall have a burden laid on it greater than it can bear. No mother shall be treated unfairly on account of her child nor father on account of his child. An heir shall be chargeable in the same way if they both decide on weaning by mutual consent and after due consultation there is no blame on them. If ye decide on a foster-mother for your offspring there is no blame on you provided ye pay (the mother) what ye offered on equitable terms. But fear Allah and know that Allah sees well what ye do.

                          4:23 Prohibited to you (for marriage) are: your mother daughters sisters father's sisters mother's sisters; brother's daughters sister's daughters foster-mothers (who gave you suck) foster-sisters; your wives' mothers; your step-daughters under your guardianship born of your wives to whom ye have gone in no prohibition if ye have not gone in; (those who have been) wives of your sons proceeding from your loins; and two sisters in wedlock at one and the same time except for what is past; for Allah is Oft-Forgiving Most Merciful.

                          33: 37 Behold! thou didst say to one who had received the grace of Allah and thy favor: "Retain thou (in wedlock) thy wife and fear Allah." But thou didst hide in thy heart that which Allah was about to make manifest: thou didst fear the people but it is more fitting that thou shouldst fear Allah. Then when Zaid had dissolved (his marriage) with her with the necessary (formality) We joined her in marriage to thee: in order that (in future) there may be no difficulty to the Believers in (the matter of) marriage with the wives of their adopted sons when the latter have dissolved with the necessary (formality) (their marriage) with them: and Allah's command must be fulfilled.


                          Hope that helps

                          Was salaam
                          Ibrahim

                          16: 92 And be not like a woman who breaks into untwisted strands the yarn which she has spun after it has become strong. Nor take your oaths to practice deception between yourselves lest one party should be more numerous than another: for Allah will test you by this; and on the Day of Judgment He will certainly make clear to you (the truth of) that wherein ye disagree.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Blood-relationship and its rights and duties do not depend on special circumstances of a temporary nature. Foster parenting is of a temporary nature. And foster/adopted children under your care will not have the same rights when it comes to inheritances under Islamic law. Nor will they have rights over natural children of that family.

                            Google's post was great. If you read that , you will see that I dont disagree with anything in it.

                            I am not saying that you ought to count your adopted child in your inheritance, unless if you wish to gift something to him/her.

                            I'm not saying that it should be treated as a biological relationship, either. Obviously, if I had an adopted "daughter", I dont see anything wrong with marrying her ex-husband. Obviously, a foster child isn't your real child, there's no blood connection.

                            What i'm talking about is something more emotional, which I believe the Quran addresses by asking people to treat their foster kids kindly and as brothers, etc.

                            I'm talking about day to day treatment toward the children of the house in terms of being nice to them and providing them with the same opportunities you provide to your real children. I hope that made my earlier comments clearer.

                            Also , Ibrahim, if you're insinuating that I'm a woman who makes up stuff, and your motive is to make me stop talking, then you're not being a very nice muslim, are you?
                            I believe in dragons, good men, and other fantasy creatures.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by PyariCgudia:
                              ......
                              I'm talking about day to day treatment toward the children of the house in terms of being nice to them and providing them with the same opportunities you provide to your real children. I hope that made my earlier comments clearer.
                              ...
                              what stops u from being nicer (providing same opportunities) to a foster child?

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                              May Allah SWT guide us all towards right and help us follow the right

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