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    DoctorNaveed or some one please Clarify

    In the previous post that started with the subject: ANDHRA wat do u think-part 2....the controversy and.... http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/Forum13/HTML/004661.html
    I found the time to go through the post completely only now and before I could respond, the thread was closed.
    However, seeing your comments and also the response of all other participants, I think you can clarify something more to me.

    One of the paragraphs said:
    "When Khalifa began his work in 1969, he attracted the attention of intellectuals, clergy and masses alike, throughout the Islamic world. Many popular magazines and newspapers of the middle east, from Morocco to Pakistan began reporting his sensational discovery. Within a short span of time, Khalifa acquired the hallowed status of a hero, who could prove to the world, combining computer and religion, what the believers knew with certainty in their hearts. By the end of 1973, he was commanding full house audiences as he lectured at the universities, mosques, organisations and in royal and presidential palaces.
    But, till this period, Khalifa had held back the data related with the two verses. The illustrative calculations released by him had not mentioned that he had got the result after excluding the two verses. Now, from 1973 onwards, he began to consider himself strong enough to release this information to the world."
    ---------------------------------------------
    Comment:
    I understand from the above paragraphs that all the quranic verses had some mathematical similarities.
    ====================
    The next part read:
    The news that Khalifa had found two verses of the Quran outside the mathematical structure exploded like a bombshell. The community till now euphoric over the discovery, became bewildered. It was a possibility unthinkable for them. The Message itself had said that it was distortion proof, protected by God Himself. It was part of the basic belief, too deeply ingrained in the psyche of the six hundred million strong community, to be accepted casually by them..."
    ---------------------------------
    Comment:
    This means Quran is tampered.
    ================================
    Next comes the bombshell:
    And then, Rashad Khalifa compounded the wow of community by dropping another bombshell. He declared himself to be the latest messenger, claiming that Muhammad was not the last. He also claimed that Gabriel now comes to him and that he had been sent to correct the Message to its pristine purity.
    Then, not content with these highly explosive claims, Rashad Khalifa began to demolish one established precept after another with impunity, through his `Authorised English Version of Quran’, other books and journals
    ----------------------------------------
    Comment:
    So, Muhammad is not the last prophet. Thanks for informing.
    =============================================
    More from your post:
    "On almost every topic he gave an opinion different from the one, established through the authority of Hadith and Sunna.
    The clergy, aghast at such utterances fought back. Some of them simply hinted about a conspiracy behind this miracle, hatched in US, questioning the motive and the credibility of the people behind this miracle...

    “Worshipers of Muhammad, Idol worshipers, False Muslims who were doomed”.
    The war hotted up. ..."
    ---------------------
    Comment:
    So, I can understand the last words, that is very clearly written. Thanks once more.
    =============================================
    and finally a sad ending to the great man:
    "...Instructions went forth from the top most Shariat authorities to all the Islamic centres of learning, throughout the world, not to discuss or debate the merits or demerits of the miracle but to remain tacit on this issue.
    The Quran was meant for guidance only and not to find hidden mathematical structures. The Ulema did not issue any fatwa to kill Rashad Khalifa. The man was simply a renegade scholar whose claims were unacceptable to the generally tolerant orthodox community. But a hothead of the community, inflamed by the utterances of Rashad Khalifa, ultimately killed him in the Tucson mosque itself, on the morning of 31st. January 1990, before the morning prayers."

    ================================
    Thanks for enlightening us more on Islam.

    #2
    Victory, I have a new found respect for you for going through that turgid article!!!

    If you come out of Metallurgy you will make a darned good lawyer in US!!

    Doctornaveed Gadu Pedda Verri Puku!!!!


    Comment


      #3
      Thanks Andhra, I will keep your suggestion in mind and get out of this austenite, if possible and if I get more bucks.

      "Peddda Thikka Puku kakapothe vaadi goyyi vaade thovvukuntaadaa mari"

      Comment


        #4

        I'm not taking sides here, but it is a well known fact that Rashad Khilafa is a Numerologist and totally disregards the A'Hadeeths. It his his obssession with numbers that moved him into denial and clarifies his stance and sect.

        It must also be noted that when the Qur'aan was revealed, the Arabs were experts in Poetry and not Algebra, as is required in order to work out the calculations for prayer units etc etc.

        People at the time of revelation could just about grasp the message, let alone be expert Mathematicians!!


        Comment


          #5
          Welcome back brother Sholay!

          Victory and company, reading your replies simply strengthens my beleif, thank you for proving me several verses of Quran, especially the one which talks about blinds, closed hearts, deaf to the message! I actually should be thankful to Allah SWT for providing me you as proof.

          ------------------
          May Allah SWT guide us all towards right and help us follow the right

          [This message has been edited by Changez_like (edited March 26, 2002).]

          Comment


            #6

            Salaam Changez Like

            It's both good and sad to be back.

            Good, that the Forum is alive and kicking and

            Sad, that some people are still regressing rather than progressing and are repetative parrots.

            Don't worry, I'm sure we will take the new faces to school and back, like usual!!!!

            Comment


              #7
              Dear Changez
              Ever at your service. I was not posting my words or I did not get these ideas from an hate website. I got them from gup shup and posted by a devout Muslim (I believe) and seconded by many regulars of Gup Shup. Hence I decided to accept what the article posted here said. http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/Forum13/HTML/004661.html

              I have in my Hand "The Song Celestial", also the "The Bhagavad Gita" and I have enjoyed divine joy reading it. I understand the joy you might get when you truly believe and read a holy book with devotion. I am not ridiculing your faith or religion, I believe that there are many ways of reaching God and one of the ways is devotion towards him.
              I truly believe in some of the Sanskrit scriptures which I have learnt, By-Heart,
              The translation reads as follows,

              "Like all the rivers of the land follow different paths but reach the same entity of Sea, similarly all the prayers offered to different forms belong to Keshava alone"

              I believe that irrespective of what you call, God is one, you call him Allah and I call him Keshava. Now tell me do you accept this ?

              Comment


                #8
                [QUOTE]Originally posted by Victory:

                I found the time to go through the post completely only now and before I could respond,

                WHAT a liar ,if u had read it completely u wud have read the following:Surprisingly, the sum came to be a multiple of 19, whether chapter 9 was taken to consist of 129 verses or 127 verses. This result also confirmed that verses 128 and 129 of chapter 9, did not lie outside the mathematical structure,
                The chapter 9 now included the two verses that had been claimed by Rashad Khalifa as being later additions. Entering the new data into the computer, we checked the first large number involving chapter 9, and immediately hit pay dirt.


                . A calculation that further confirmed the presence of the two verses 9:128,129 in the text of Message.
                Thus, in our opinion neither had the Message ever become distorted nor was Rashad Khalifa sent as a messenger to earth. His real status lay in being the researcher par excellence, who had given to the world a mathematical structure, a tool through which humanity not only could confirm the presence of the eternally elusive Creator factor, but also remove all its doubts regarding the Message coming from Him, as a mercy to mankind.
                The beauty of this structure was that it had isolated and pointed towards two verses in the entire text.
                It was in the interpretation of these verses, we believe, that Satan had misled the Great Researcher on a trail of red herring.
                The explanation that was as clear as a day to him was that it was the `two verses’ that were the elusive key to the Ultimate Code....

                any non medical person wud tell u u have got something wrong with ur eyes or u r just a liar. again i will add if i get kicked out for pointing out a truth SO BE IT.

                Comment


                  #9
                  ANDHRA QUOTE;You share one thing with Ibrahim. Both of you prefer not to give URLs for your posts!!!
                  I wonder why!!

                  Anyway concerning this second post, since you didn't summarize it, let me do so.

                  1.There is something mysterious about the prime number 19!!!

                  2.Some Muslim scholar went to great pains trying to correlate the number 19 and Koranic Verses and came to the conclusion that Koran is an extra-terrestrial revelation.

                  Fine, if you want to believe it!!

                  See my point ?


                  URLS and many more on the nethttp://www.submission.org/quran/
                  http://www.submission.org/khalifa.html
                  http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywo.../MIQ/stat.html
                  http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywo.../Ultimate.html

                  1)the prophet was not a parha likha man like u
                  2)he did not have a computer for the mathematics dealt with numbers as large as these=9,127,1234567891011....125126127.
                  3)ofcourse the quran is extra-terrestrial


                  GET THE POINT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Doctor Naved,

                    My religion and my parents taught me to be respectful to others and I do not indulge in one verbal slanging.

                    I just posted what you have posted and asked for clarification. You are accepting Khilafas's ideas only as long as they suit you and rejecting when he points out the other. I truly pity you.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Changez_like:
                      Welcome back brother Sholay!

                      I actually should be thankful to Allah SWT for providing me you as proof.

                      WELL U KNOW Changez_like
                      for the believer no miracle is necessary
                      for the non believer no miracle is enough

                      and i think just to ignore ppl like andhra who constantly ridicule islam and find faults is a sin .i do wat i can

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Victory:
                        Doctor Naved,

                        My religion and my parents taught me to be respectful to others and I do not indulge in one verbal slanging.

                        I just posted what you have posted and asked for clarification. You are accepting Khilafas's ideas only as long as they suit you and rejecting when he points out the other. I truly pity you.

                        if u bother to read he was proven wrong .seems that u do lie.truth is the truth


                        [This message has been edited by doctornaveeed (edited March 26, 2002).]

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Victory:
                          .....
                          I just posted what you have posted and asked for clarification. You are accepting Khilafas's ideas only as long as they suit you and rejecting when he points out the other. I truly pity you.
                          are you suggesting that Rashad Khalifa was "perfect man" and whatever he uttered is Truth and Authentic?

                          ------------------
                          May Allah SWT guide us all towards right and help us follow the right

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I am not suggesting anything. In the beginning of the article it is written that all quranic verses had a speciality of No. 19.
                            Then he discovered that two verses were not falling into the mathematical structure. Hence he thought that the Quran might be tampered.
                            I have not read anything about Rashad Khilafa untill now and heard his name for the first time. However, how can you just discount a man like that. Tomorrow, if God decides that things have gone haywire on earth and I need to send someone with a new message, then can he send or not ? Or is God powerless even to change his mind ? If God cannot change his decision or control the matters on earth, then he is not the superpower we are talking.
                            In case God decides to send a new message and sends a new Messenger to you, then how can you identify him. By killing him dont you think you are going against God.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Victory:
                              .....Tomorrow, if God decides that things have gone haywire on earth and I need to send someone with a new message, then can he send or not ? Or is God powerless even to change his mind ? If God cannot change his decision or control the matters on earth, then he is not the superpower we are talking.
                              In case God decides to send a new message and sends a new Messenger to you, then how can you identify him. By killing him dont you think you are going against God.
                              This thing will only happen if God were not able to see/determine whats coming next. May be God in Hinduism does not have much wisdom/far-sighted, but as in Islam God/Allah SWT knows future of everything, and knows whats is going to happen. Therefore, if He says in Quran that the religion is now COMPLETE and Mohammed PBUH is seal of the prophets.... it should clearly be a signal that there is no more a prophet. God also promised a "doomsday", and "day of judgement", so definitely THE END is coming and you shouldn't expect anymore changes to CONSTITUTION or RELIGION.

                              ------------------
                              May Allah SWT guide us all towards right and help us follow the right

                              [This message has been edited by Changez_like (edited March 27, 2002).]

                              Comment

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