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    Politics & Religion

    http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/Forum25/HTML/003643.html
    Originally posted by myvoice:
    Personally, I think the very idea of uniting a people based solely upon a shared religion is foolhardy and weakens rather than strengthens Muslim people and governments around the world.

    Muslims in Pakistan do not share the same problems, the same weaknesses, the same strengths, the same challenges, etc. as Muslims in China, Palestine, Indonesia, America or anywhere else. What is in the best interests of Muslims in Pakistan may be exactly contrary to what is in the best interests of Muslims in Iran, Iraq, Palestine or elsewhere. If all Muslims in Pakistan identified themselves as Pakistani first and Muslim second, they could focus on solving their problems and making Pakistan the strongest, most economically vibrant country possible. Calls for a single Muslim state or a single unified Muslim position weaken development of the nationalistic identities necessary for a strong, stable government to emerge which can improve the lives of its people. Given the differing challenges faced by Muslims around the world based upon the countries in which they live, it is really inconceivable that a single focal point of governance could effectively think up much less administer a unified program that had the remotest possibility of improving the livelihood of its people. Making EACH Muslim's problems the problem of ALL Muslim's will probably lead to a situation where NO Muslim's problems are resolved.

    Please note that my comments are not limited to Islam. It would be equally foolhardy to try to organize and govern a disparate group of people around the world based on shared Catholicism, or Protestantism, or Christianity, or Hinduism, etc. The fact of one's religious persuasian is wholly irrelevant to the problems they face and the solutions that resolve same. How a shared belief in Catholicism is relevant to solving the problems of poor Catholics in Mexico versus poor Catholics in America or Italy escapes me. There simply is no "Muslim World" just as there is no Catholic World, Jewish World, Hindu World, Christian World, etc.

    For many years, the very idea of a Catholic president of the US was rejected because of a fear that a Catholic's allegiance would be first to his religion and the Pope rather than first to America. Similarly, until Lieberman, no Jew was nominated by a major party to run for President or Vice President because of the underlying mistrust that allegiance to the US would be tainted by a more powerful allegiance to the Jewish state of Israel.

    This is not to suggest that Muslim's should not be proud of and cultivate relationships built upon the mutual, shared identity of being Muslim. Once a strong vibrant Pakistan, a strong vibrant Indonesia, a strong vibrant Saudi Arabia, etc. emerge as shining examples of self sufficiency and take care of the needs and desires of their own people, pouring aid and assistance into other poorer Muslim countries to help them solve their problems makes perfect sense.

    I respectfully suggest that the problems faced by Muslim populations around the world would be better addressed and more likely to be resolved through emergence of strong, disparate, nationalistic oriented countries in Muslim majority areas rather than through attempts to "unify" or create a single Muslim World.

    Myvoice:

    Personally, I think the very idea of uniting the world based upon the ideals of the capitalistic “religion” (the principles of so – called democracy, and free market economy and its labels such as Third World, Less Economically Developed Countries, Civilised World, International Coalition etc. are just a few of its ritualistic expressions) is rather foolhardy and doomed to failure.

    “Religion” is nothing more than an ideology consisting of a set of core beliefs/values. Politics is just an institutional form of expression of that ideology. So I maintain the view that religion and politics cannot be separated but rather that each is dependent upon the other. For example, democracy is a necessary political expression of Capitalism and its core values, although its core values are very limited in that they are more to do with economics than social issues (whereas the traditional Abrahamic faiths are “socialistic”).

    Having a unified political identity does not necessarily mean having a single government for all the countries involved, as evident in the Europe Union. Therefore to have a political identity will not serve to weaken the Muslim People, but will in the long term, in my view be very fruitful. This allows for each nation to solve its own problems through its own governing state, but also to be an organised political and economical institution with a collective identity.

    I agree, there is no “Muslim World” in the political sense, as yet, but that doesn’t mean it cannot be so in the future. If you look at the Muslim countries, the very problem is that they are disparate, nationalistic oriented countries. You have a mix of feudal monarchy, nationalistic democracy, Communist Ba’athist regimes and pure dictatorships which all make for very weak and dependent countries.

    Your comparison of Islam with other religions is futile. Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism etc do NOT have an independent “prescribed” political and economical system, whereas Islam does. Even the implementation of the social and judicial system requires a form of political framework to be present. Take the example of Israel, a supposedly Jewish state, which in fact does not even have a “Jewish” political or economical or even social identity but is a secular capitalistic state – a mini USA. Iran on the other hand, having been a carbon copy of the States, is now a country with an Islamic political, social and economical system – a truly independent, progressive and dynamic country.

    Even though the “Islamic World” is an anathema (to some extent) to the political and economical principles of the Western “powers that be”, I think its high time “opposing” Ideologies / Systems are recognised as equally valid as the current dogma. I believe the post 9/11 events have just set the ball rolling in favour of the Muslim World.


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    [email protected]~Kul de Khair [email protected]~

    Freedom Without Responsibility is Disastrous

    #2
    Islam was a great civilisation due to the very existence of its political, economical and social system. Once these systems became replaced with other ideologies, the civilisations collapsed. The very existence of Islam is synonymous with politics.

    "Islam has never failed, merely paused".

    With the upheavals of the world today, we are witnessing an end to the long pause.

    Comment


      #3
      its all economics
      the poor need a way of expressing thier anger and frustration against the rich first it was communism now its religion

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