Namaaz e Janaza Ghusl . . . Funeral Bathing

[CocoNut]

I was at the Islamic Foundation recently and it crossed my mind when I saw the person who usually gives the corpse a cleansing bath before they burry it.

The person happened to be a male and when the funeral prayer actually occured there was a female body lying there. What puzzles me is that isn't the person who bathes the body suppose to be of the same gender?

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Jitna Diya Sarkar Nay Mujko, Itni Meri Auqat Nahi, Yeh Saab Tumhara Karam Hai Aqa, Mujh Mein Aisi Koi Baat Nahin.


Love happens once . . .

[Sarah Splendor]

.

[Thap]

Fair enough


[This message has been edited by Thap (edited November 10, 2001).]

[CocoNut]

Thap, seriously man. You gotta grow up. Please. This was not on my mind when we burried the deceased today. Kindly think before you say anything further of this sort. If you feel the urge there is always Cafe.

Thank You

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Jitna Diya Sarkar Nay Mujko, Itni Meri Auqat Nahi, Yeh Saab Tumhara Karam Hai Aqa, Mujh Mein Aisi Koi Baat Nahin.


Love happens once . . .

[Thap]

Get off yah high horse, this was in refernce to SS.

You must question everything before you in public, this I find more childish.

[Thap]

Instead of trusting other muslims...and if unsure asking someone present at the funeral..you saved this choice chestnut for the forum, mashallah.

[CocoNut]

Saved it for here because it was inappropriate for me to speak to mourners at the time.

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Jitna Diya Sarkar Nay Mujko, Itni Meri Auqat Nahi, Yeh Saab Tumhara Karam Hai Aqa, Mujh Mein Aisi Koi Baat Nahin.


Love happens once . . .

[FactFinder]

Originally posted by CocoNut:
What puzzles me is that isn't the person who bathes the body suppose to be of the same gender?

The person who bathes has to be of the same gender, but the funeral prayers are performed by males, so the leader has to be a male.

[Ali_R]

No I don't think that the person who bathes have to be of the same gender.
Some sensible proof needed here.

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• “na maiN momin vich masiitaaN, na maiN muusaa, na fir'aun!”
  

[FactFinder]

Originally posted by Ali_R:
No I don't think that the person who bathes have to be of the same gender.
Some sensible proof needed here.

I will need to look it up, but it is obvious from the point of view of hijab. I remember reading a hadeeth that a man is allowed to bathe his wife, provided there is no woman available. But to bathe a namahram is not acceptable.

My contention is further substantiated by the fact that when a woman is laid inside a grave, only mahram men are allowed to go down into the grave.

[Girl from Quraysh]

In my opinion, Everyone, should know how to perform the ghusl for a dead body. The reason for this being that the body of a deceased adult male should be bathed by his father, son or brother; while that of an adult female should be bathed by her mother, daughter or sister.

If none of these people are not present, than any near relative should carry out this duty, (male for male and female for female). If no relatives are present or none of them are in the position to perform ghusl, then the most pious person present should be requested to perform this rite. Keep in mind, the person performing the ghusl must be himself or herself paak and in a state of wudhu.

*If a male passes away and there are NO males to bathe him, then no other woman besides his Wife is permitted to carry out the ghusl.

*In the case of a woman, if there are NO ladies to perform the ghusl, the Husband cannot perform the ghusl of his wife.

In both of the above cases (*) Tayammum should be performed. The Tayammum for ghusl is the same as that for wudhu.

A child who has NOT reached the age of puberty (male or female) may be given ghusl by any adult, male or female, if a member of the same gender is not available.



[This message has been edited by Girl from Quraysh (edited November 10, 2001).]

[FactFinder]

Originally posted by Girl from Quraysh:

*In the case of a woman, if there are NO ladies to perform the ghusl, the Husband cannot perform the ghusl of his wife.

If there are no ladies and no mahram, the husband would be the most appropriate, according to my understanding. I agree that with death the relationship ceases, but even then he would be better choice than other men. Would like to see some reference, though.

In both of the above cases (*) Tayammum should be performed. The Tayammum for ghusl is the same as that for wudhu.

This does not seem logical, shall appreciate reference as tayammum for wudhu is where there is no water. Here we are talking about absence of correct people to do the ghusl. The parallel is odd.

But you have basically confirmed that the ghusl has to be done for the same sex.

[Girl from Quraysh]

Factfinder,

Ask any learned person, or for that matter open up any book on such matters and you'll find what I said was right.

If there are no ladies and no mahram, the husband would be the most appropriate, according to my understanding. I agree that with death the relationship ceases, but even then he would be better choice than other men. Would like to see some reference, though.

I don't agree with your understanding. With death, the nikah is broken, the relationship between husband and wife ceases to be, as you acknowledge, for that reason the husband is not allowed to give ghusl to the wife. I did not mention anything about 'other men' having to perform the ghusl, in such a circumstance, I merely said that the husband would not be permitted to perform it, it follows that the responsibility to would fall to the father, brother, son, if there were no women present to perform the ghusl-in the form of tayammum for the deceased.

Factfinder,

You say you find the parallel odd.

I say there is no parallel.

If you ponder upon it, you will clearly realize that its done for the reasons of modesty, as it is done in the cases of deceased adults where those of the same gender of the deceased are unavailable to perform ghusl.

[Ali_R]

Originally posted by Girl from Quraysh:
In my opinion, Everyone, should know how to perform the ghusl for a dead body. The reason for this being that the body of a deceased adult male should be bathed by his father, son or brother; while that of an adult female should be bathed by her mother, daughter or sister.

If none of these people are not present, than any near relative should carry out this duty, (male for male and female for female). If no relatives are present or none of them are in the position to perform ghusl, then the most pious person present should be requested to perform this rite. Keep in mind, the person performing the ghusl must be himself or herself paak and in a state of wudhu.

*If a male passes away and there are NO males to bathe him, then no other woman besides his Wife is permitted to carry out the ghusl.

*In the case of a woman, if there are NO ladies to perform the ghusl, the Husband cannot perform the ghusl of his wife.

In both of the above cases (*) Tayammum should be performed. The Tayammum for ghusl is the same as that for wudhu.

A child who has NOT reached the age of puberty (male or female) may be given ghusl by any adult, male or female, if a member of the same gender is not available.

[This message has been edited by Girl from Quraysh (edited November 10, 2001).]

OK but is this written in Quran or some Hadith???? If not is it "tradition" and if so then it doesnt count, does it??

Don't think I wanna bother you, but I just want a proof that is valid.

Thank you.

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• “na maiN momin vich masiitaaN, na maiN muusaa, na fir'aun!”