Question for Shias

[CoolDude]

If I believe in Allahs word (Quran) and Prophet Muhammed and his sunnah, and I don't believe that Hazrat Ali should have been the 1st Khalifh (as he was the 4th) - can I go to paradise?

simple question, no need to deviate. I repeat (for those who didn't understand it the first time) simple question, no need to deviate

Jazakallah

[alizadeh2000]

Ali(AS) is his Sunnah.

This should answer your question.

Originally posted by CoolDude:
If I believe in Allahs word (Quran) and Prophet Muhammed and his sunnah, and I don't believe that Hazrat Ali should have been the 1st Khalifh (as he was the 4th) - can I go to paradise?

simple question, no need to deviate. I repeat (for those who didn't understand it the first time) simple question, no need to deviate

Jazakallah

[zawiyaefikr]

CoolDude!

Only if going to Paradise was so easy. The road to Paradise is full with self restraint, piety, selflessness, worship, and firm belief on the Oneness of Allah (it is easier said than done, thou!!)

What difference does it make weather you consider Syedna Ali or Syedna Abu Bakr, fourth or first or in whatever order. All companions of Prophet were well and thoughful choice of Prophet Mohammad, pbuh and they all left equaly impressive deeds behinds. To underscore anyone of them is to suspect the choice of our Prophet.

[CoolDude]

zawiyaefikr: Thats exactly my point. Our goal as a muslim is to please Allah and gain Paradise. People would have you believe that if you don't believe that Hazrat Ali should have been the first Khaliph then you cannot go to Paradise.

[zman]

I have seen most sunnis and shias get tangled over an issue that is not really tied to ones faith.

We as muslims, need to follow Quran and Sunnah and strive for the Deen of Allah(SWT).

Arguing over who should' ve gotten the khilafah and who should'nt have is pretty much useless contemplation because its not a requirement for a muslim.

Leave the differences b/w shia and sunni and lets come together as an ummah on the basic principals that form the pillars of Islam, then see our strength - InshaAllah and Ameen.

[a1shah]

CoolDude,

As you are well aware by now, the issue is whether you recognize Ali (as) as the holy imam, and Allah's (swt) and our holy prophet's (pbuh) chosen representative.

Whether you recognize him as the first or 4th calipha is inconsequential, since what you consider as the calipha is just a worldly title. These are just number games.

Only Allah (swt) knows whether one goes to heaven or hell.

But this much I can tell you - you will be violating the Almighty's (swt) command by not accepting the wilayat of the 12 holy imams (as).

ws.

[wasir]

Dear Cooldude,

Good thread, I really like logical questions.

I can't judge about you, a common Muslim, that you will go into Heaven or not..

But I am very clever you know....

I can decide about those people who lived all their life with the Prophet(peace be upon him) and they were a duplicate of Prophet(peace be upon him) in every single act, that they will go to hell(they are labelled Munafiqs and Munafiqs will go to hell).....

How celver I am??????????

[CoolDude]

LOL! @ Wasir.

That is a good point.. If only Allah swt knows who is going to heaven and hell.. then why do (some) of you curse Hazrat Aisha and other Sahabas?

Isn't Allah going to judge them as well?

[alizadeh2000]

Wasir, the only person who lived ALL his life with the Prophet PBUH, was Ali (AS).

There was no other.

He was brought up in the very home of the Prophet PBUH since his infant days. He spent his day and night with the Prophet, right from childhood, eating, drinking, sleeping, in the company of the Prophet PBUH and the one to spend the most time with him in the entire history of mankind.

Furthermore, he was born in the Ka'aba, the only person in history to have had this honor.

Therefore there is no comparison of the Gate of Knowledge with anyone at all. He is on an entirely different level. You just cannot compare apples with oranges.

The Sahabis began learning from the Prophet PBUH much later, after they accepted Islam.

There is just no comparison between the two.

Originally posted by wasir:
Dear Cooldude,

Good thread, I really like logical questions.

I can't judge about you, a common Muslim, that you will go into Heaven or not..

But I am very clever you know....

I can decide about those people who lived all their life with the Prophet(peace be upon him) and they were a duplicate of Prophet(peace be upon him) in every single act, that they will go to hell(they are labelled Munafiqs and Munafiqs will go to hell).....

How celver I am??????????

[This message has been edited by alizadeh2000 (edited July 21, 2001).]

[Shah Jahan]

Can anyone answer my Question........

If Cristains and jews belive in allah only (plus if they were pious and good ect. ect.)will they go to hell for not beliving in Prophet Mohammed?



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When the Lion is Dead, Every Assthinks it can Kick it!!!!

[Changez_like]

Originally posted by Shah Jahan:
Can anyone answer my Question........

If Cristains and jews belive in allah only (plus if they were pious and good ect. ect.)will they go to hell for not beliving in Prophet Mohammed?

are you implying that 'not beleiving' in "Prophet PBUH" is same as 'not beleiving' in Hazrat Ali (RA) as 1st khalifa???

Here I'm not questioning whether Hazrat Ali (RA) was Imam or not. As in other threads, some Shia bros replied that Hazrat Ali (RA) was not seeking the worldly 'kingship' (and I beleive that) when responding to "why Hazrat Ali (RA) did not oppose openly khilafa of first 3 khalifas?".

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We oughta be Changez like, don't we?

[Pagluu]

In my view, believing in Allah alone is not enough. One must FOLLOW Allah's commands strictly too, if he is to get nijaat

If Rasool-Allah left behind a Khalif and a Imam to be followed, and one decideds only to sing praises for him and not FOLLOW him, then you s/he is not on SIraat-e-Mustaqim. Thats all i can say.

Heaven or Hell? no one could decided that except for Allah since he has all our aamals in front of him, nice and clear.



[This message has been edited by Pagluu (edited July 20, 2001).]

[Shah Jahan]

Changez like

Lets make one thing clear "shias no matter what do not compare Hazrat Ali to Huzoor"

And I wasn't answering your Question I was answering Cooldude as he asked if He does not belive in Hazrat Ali he will not go to hell!!

It is very difficult to say who will get Janat on what basis. Think on it this way

A very pious Cristain who has done only good in his life and denys Propht Muhammeds right. Does he go to hell?

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When the Lion is Dead, Every Assthinks it can Kick it!!!!

[Sheraz CT]

i think if we do sins in this world..we will have to pay for them

and probably i will spend some time in hell for the sins i have committed..but thats not really such a bad thing..cuz i will get to kick some munafiq [email protected]@ in the hell..if u know what i mean

[wasir]

Dear bro,
Whatever you have mentioned here about Hadrat Ali(Radi Allah an hu) is total truth no Sunni disagrees with it but still that doesn't mean that he should have been first Khalifah caz he was Cousin, son in law or close friend of Prophet(peace be upon him and his family), it would have been kingship not Khilapah.

And we don't do any comparison among Sahabas who was better and who wasn't, we love them caz they lived with Prophet(peace be upon him and his family) and he was happy with them before he departed.

So what difference does it make
And this selection of Khaliphas was supported by majority of Sahabas, were they all wrong, if so then which Islam are we talking about????

And what did Hadrat Abu Bakr(Radi Allah an hu) earn from this Caliphship

Money
Wealth
Land and cattles
Kingship for his sons or family

Originally posted by alizadeh2000:
Wasir, the only person who lived ALL his life with the Prophet PBUH, was Ali (AS).

There was no other.

He was brought up in the very home of the Prophet PBUH since his infant days. He spent his day and night with the Prophet, right from childhood, eating, drinking, sleeping, in the company of the Prophet PBUH and the one to spend the most time with him in the entire history of mankind.

Furthermore, he was born in the Ka'aba, the only person in history to have had this honor.

Therefore there is no comparison of the Gate of Knowledge with anyone at all. He is on an entirely different level. You just cannot compare apples with oranges.

The Sahabis began learning from the Prophet PBUH much later, after they accepted Islam.

There is just no comparison between the two.




[This message has been edited by alizadeh2000 (edited July 21, 2001).]