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    True Muslim

    Can any one explain the difference between a Muslim and an Ahmadee Muslim and please be brief so I can read the whole thing and understand it. No cut and paste of lengthy web pages.

    #2

    TO BE FRANK, AN AHMADEE IS A FOLLOWER OF MAN CALLED GHULAM MIRZA AHMED, WHO RESIDED IN INDIA/PAKISTAN.

    MAINLY PREVALENT IN PAKISTAN THOUGH.

    HE CLAIMED TO BE THE AL MEHDI, JESUS INCARNATE, DESCENDANT OF THE HOLY PROPHET PBUH, AMONGST OTHER THINGS.

    I HOPE THIS IS SHORT ENOUGH FOR U, HOWEVER U MAY FIND FOLLOWERS OF AHMED CLAIMING DIFFERNTLY, BUT RECORDS AND FACTS DO NOT LIE!

    I'LL DEAL WITH THAT ISSUE WHEN IT ARISES.

    Comment


      #3
      Ahmadi web sites are saying that he never claimed to be a descsendant of the Profit, He was a reformer who, in his time, in the presence of rising tide of christianity and its flase propaganda against Islam, wanted to present Islam as a universal, tolerant and complete religion accepatable to the whole humanity.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by amy:
        Ahmadi web sites are saying that he never claimed to be a descsendant of the Profit,.
        Yeah he never talked about "profit" and "loss"

        its kinda like the whole mormon thing with christianity ya know

        Comment


          #5
          Amy

          Allow us only to inform you that, in 1974, after an exhaustive examination of all the evidence presented for and against the Qadianis in Mekkah Mukarramah, the Muslim World League (Rabita Alame Islami) -- which represents all religious scholars from every Muslim country of the world -- passed an unanimous resolution declaring the Qadiani Movement and its leaders as apostate, kafir, disbeliever, and out of the fold of Islam. As you are certainly aware, declaring someone a non-Muslim is a task taken very seriously by the Muslim scholars. The fact that they have unanimously declared Qadianism distinct from Islam should assure you that a thorough examination of their claims has been made.

          Mirza Ghulam Qadiani’s life was laden with contradictory and anti-Islamic claims. In 1880, he declared himself to be only a Muslim writer; in 1885, he announced he was a revivalist (Mujaddid); in 1891, he claimed to be the Promised Mehdi and the Promised Messiah; and in 1901, he pronounced himself a prophet of God! Facing an open and strong opposition by Muslim Scholars and religious leaders for this blasphemous declaration and other teachings which belittled Jesus Christ(pbuh) and contradicted the Quranic revelations, he also announced that he was the second and improved coming of the Prophet Muhammad(SAW) with authority to reinterpret the Holy Quran at his pleasure! Not happy with mere prophethood, in 1904, he declared himself the Krishna (the Hindu Lord). Obviously, like an unethical modern-day politician, he was trying to appeal to all uneducated segments of the public in India!

          Fortunately, the Almighty Allah(SWT), time and time again, exposed Mirza Ghulam Qadiani's falsehood through his own statements and so-called prophecies. Even many of his own family members were aware of his treachery and openly opposed his anti-Islamic teachings. Mirza Ghulam Qadiani finally died by intervention of the Almighty Allah and as the result of religious prayer challenges (Mubahala), in 1908.

          Is this enough evidence now!

          Comment


            #6
            Ahmadis are claiming to be a separate movement from Qadianis and all that chronology that you have mentioned, according to them, are false allegations with no proof in Mirza's writings.

            If someone recites the 'Kalima', according to Islam, he/she is considered a muslim and that's what Ahmadis have on their web sites every where. Are you saying that if I call myself a muslim, some one can declare me a non-muslim? Is that an Islamic teaching?

            Comment


              #7
              Hey Amy like you as a smart "ahmadi"
              Take care.

              Comment


                #8
                Amy,

                There are many cases that a person who recites the kalima can be called a kafir. If they rule by other than Islam. If they reject an ayah of the Qur'an. If they reject Mutawatir hadith like the Prophet(saw)'s last sermon where the Prophet (saw) clearly says :

                "...O People, no prophet or apostle will come after me and no new faith will be born. Reason well, therefore, O People, and understand my words which I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the Qur'an and my example, the Sunnah and if you follow these you will never go astray..."

                Comment


                  #9
                  Scarface:

                  The things that you have mentioned in your post, are all accepted by ahmadees. The call Mirza a reformer, they consider Quran the final word of God and they consider Prophet Mohammed the final messenger of God, so where's the problem. There are many examples in the history where several non ahmadee figures have claimed to recieve a message from God and their graves are worshipped by thousands of Muslims in Pakistan and every where else e.g. Data Sahib in Lahore is one.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Mr AMY,

                    There is a concept among common Muslims that Hazrat Isa who is still alive in the Heavens shall come from Heavens to make reforms in Muslims. Islam shall make quick progress in his period etc etc.

                    Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahamed Sahib has claimed that he himself is that promissed Masih. He has proved that according to Quran & Bible, Hazrat Isa was died in the age of 120 and is not alived in the Heavens.

                    It is a proven fact for me and is quite easy for you to confirm.

                    There are a lot of Anti-Ahmedia websites. You can contact any of them and ask the following simple question:

                    "Is there a single Aayet in Holy Quran available that clearly describe that Hazrat Isa WAS NOT DIED AND WAS RAISED TOWARD HEAVENS AND IS STILL ALIVE IN HEAVENS."

                    I myself has asked this question to some such site admins and I can gaurentee you that they shall never be able to give you a satisfactory answer.

                    So Mirza Sahib not only have PROVED that Hazrat Isa is not alived in the Heavens but was died like all humans, but he also have proved that HE HIMSELF IS THE PROMISSED MASIH. To make it brief I am not going in its details.

                    So in brief this is the difference between common Muslims and Ahmedy-Muslims.

                    Common Muslims are still waiting for the promissed Masih who shall NEVER COME for them from Heavens and Ahmedy-Muslims has accepted the Masih who was infact promissed to Muslims by Islam.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      This topic has discussed many times in this forum so I am not here to add to it but looking at internet I see no sites from Ahmaddies except one while there are dozen or more sites and some specially few who are dedicated areas on ahmadies. In short and according to my knowledge of Quran and Hadith ANY PERSON WHO RECITE SHADAH (KLMA TYIABA) HAS TO BE ACCPTED AS MUSLIM AND ANY MUSLIM WHO DECLARE SUCH PERSON NON-MUSLIM AUTOMATICALLY BECOMES NON_MSULIM HIMSELF.

                      However you can call any muslim Kafir (non believer) because it will be God Almighty who decide on day of judgement who was believer or who was non-believer.

                      In short it does not matter if all of Muslim ummah decide to call ahmadies Kafir because it will be God Almighty who decide who was kafir. This is my firm believe and this is very reason why muslims are having problems because we spent most of our energies calling each other kafir.

                      However I fear that what we see in pakistan is result of our own actions. pakistan is only country where we seen killing of Ahmdies on the name of God. Pakistan is only country where if ahmdies wear Kalma badge they get maximum of 3 years in prison. pakistan is only country where we demolished ahmadies mosques with Kalma Shada write right at front. So sometimes I am not surprise that msulims in general and pakistan specially are punished from God for their deeds. Only Allah knows better who is true muslim.


                      ------------------
                      "Away from Eyes......Close to Heart"

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Another Difference between Common Muslims and ahmedi-Muslims.
                        ............................................

                        Common Muslims cannot face the facts.

                        Evidence is that the report of 1974 National Assembly session in which Ahmedies were declared as Non-Muslims is still banned for publishing and this report is not open for general public just like Hamood-ur-Rehman report some time ago.

                        Another evidence is that Ahmedia Books are totally banned in Pakistan.

                        So the above two evidences show that Common Muslims (I mean only Pakistani Common Muslims) cannot face the facts.

                        Thay just have closed their eyes:
                        But they cannot change the facts with their eyes closed:

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Insaaniat:

                          Well said. Lack of knowledge is abound amongst muslims, especially pakis. If instead of reciting quran, people would read it, understand it in their own language and act on it, then there will be very little debate. After all quran is the final word of God. As for as calling another muslim a kafir, I don't think a true muslim will ever do that.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Here are two questions for Qadiyanis.
                            What do you say that there is no Prophet after Prophet Muhammad(sall Allah ho Alaihe Wasallam).

                            Hadrat Isa(ALAIHE ISALM) is not dead and he will come back.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by wasir:
                              Here are two questions for Qadiyanis.
                              What do you say that there is no Prophet after Prophet Muhammad(sall Allah ho Alaihe Wasallam).

                              Hadrat Isa(ALAIHE ISALM) is not dead and he will come back.

                              Before giving you the answers I would like to ask you "Can you declare Ahmedies as Non-Muslims or Koffer on the basis of any of the above questions keeping in mind the following statements?

                              Both these issues are not necessary to convert a Non-Muslim to a Muslim.

                              To convert a Non-Muslim to a Muslim, only Kalima-e-Shahadat is required.

                              You must be well aware of the fact that in Kalima-e-Shahadat, there is no mention of any of the above two issues.


                              So if you still insist that since there is difference among Ahmedies and other Muslims in details so Ahmedies can be declared as Non-Muslims then this case would apply to all other Muslim communities as well because they also have differences not in basic issues but in details.

                              Another point you should note.

                              Hazrat Maulana Abu-Al-Kalaam Aazzad who was declared as Amam-ul-Hind in his life, his statement is before me.

                              He has declared in quite clear words that despite the fact that he differs in beliefs to that of most of the beliefs of Ahmedies but HOWEVER HE CONSIDER AHMEDIES AS TRUE MUSLIMS. AHMEDIES HAVE FULL RIGHTS TO OFFER PRAYERS IN ANY OF THE MOSQUES. ANY MUSLIM WHO FORBID THEM TO DO SO IS NOT ON THE RIGHT.
                              IT IS ALSO NOT RIGHT FOR OTHER MUSLIMS TO CONSIDER AHMEDIES AS NON-MUSLIMS IN ANY WAY.


                              So if you still consider Ahmedies as Non-Muslim even after keeping the Hazrat Maulana Abu-al-Kalaam's statement, Then I would like to ask you about the Islam of Hazrat Maulana Abu-al-Kalaam Azaad.

                              Comment

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