The substitution theory

[Zalim]

• Its been a while on this forum that we have been discussing Jesus, but never came across the discussion on substitution of Jesus with someone likelys.
  
  Few questions arise in this naïve mind.
  
• Was he really substituted? Does Quran or Hadith say anything about it? Any references?
  
• How did it happen? If Jesus designed and planned the disguise, then he is coward and cheat. He caused an apparent innocent person to die for him. If Allah caused the feature of a different person to get changed and made him to die, then it is injustice on part of Allah. With the vast power and possibilities of Allah, He could have accomplished this matter in more graceful manner.
  
• If saving Jesus was the main intention of Allah, then quietly Jesus should have been raised. There was no need to kill a different person in his place. The Jews would have got a message that Jesus was indeed a prophet.
  
• If appearance of a different person can become like Jesus, then what stopped Jesus' appearance to become like a different person? If Jesus' appearance was made to change, then the Jews could not have identified him and he could have been saved. Besides, no killing would have taken place.
  
• If the likeness of Jesus was shown to the Jews, then what was shown to the actual followers? Were the actual followers led to believe that the substituted person was actual Jesus?
  
• If the actual followers knew that the substituted person was not actual Jesus, why did some of them follow the substituted person to the place of crucifixion? Were they making a fun of the situation?
  
• If the actual Jesus was raised alive before the incidence of crucifixion, why did the followers not mention it to the Jews? Were they scared? Scared of what? Jesus was already saved by then. By remaining silent, the actual followers made a different person to die for no fault of his.
  
  Where is the scope to accommodate the substitution theory?
  
  PS: This is not an Ahmadi/Qadiani issue. I hope you will talk relevantly and noting less.

[AQ]

Re: The substitution theory

>>>Was he really substituted? Does Quran or Hadith say anything about it? Any references?

That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-

An-Nisa (The Women) [4:157]



The person who actually betrayed among the companions had been cruicfied and as a punishment.. He was not an innocent to begin with!... You may wanna consult the Gospel of Barnabas for detail description which also fits the above ayah and many ahaadeeth

[sadzzz]

Re: The substitution theory

Originally posted by Zalim:
If Allah caused the feature of a different person to get changed and made him to die, then it is injustice on part of Allah. With the vast power and possibilities of Allah, He could have accomplished this matter in more graceful manner.

hmmm im sure Allah Mian knew exactly what He was doing.... Allah is all wise and all knowing.. and He does justice not unjustice..

i dont think there is any clear knowledge of what happened.. all i know is Allah Mian lifted Jesus (dunno physically or just spiritually)... not sure when.. either during the crucification or when the men went into the cave.... no one is sure how many men were taken into the cave either..

but yeah... a lot of things happen... babies die, accidents happen, theres incurable deseases.. would u also call that injustice on part of God?

[fatehahmad]

Mr. Anwaar:

Why do we need to consult a gospel when we have Holy Quran in front of us.

[AQ]

Originally posted by fatehahmad:
Mr. Anwaar:

Why do we need to consult a gospel when we have Holy Quran in front of us.

I know and i agree. but the reason i mentioned that because there are people who being muslim rely on chrisitian views more than a quranic point of view ... i just made a reference for those who want a cross reference :-)... For me, Quran, Sunnah and ahaadeeth are more than enough!