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    'NAB cannot check corruption in army'

    http://www.dawn.com/2002/04/21/top12.htm

    Army is the foundation and major source of corruption in Pakistan. If army people are not nabbed in corruption charges, the trickle down of corrupt money would continue to politicians and bureaucracy. If today politicians and civilians are made scapegoat and punished for corruption, the action would result in more corruption in politicians and civilians in future.

    Sincerely,
    FARID

    #2
    Farid- you are right. Army has been in charge of Pak for half its existence, they are responsible for the state of Pak as much as any politician. Yet every time they take over they act like they are angels who have never stolen a cent.

    NS+co was undoubtedly corrupt, but what Pak needs is a democratic system that is allowed to develop to the stage where only good leaders are elected. If you read the evolution of proper democracies in the world, you will see this is how it happened.

    With the result being they are now developed, leading countries that Pakistanis try so hard to emigrate to- ironic!

    Bringing the system to a crashing halt ever few years and replacing it with an equally (if not more) corrupt Army govt one does no good.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by RealDeal:
      Abdali- have you forgotten NAB+Mush let NS go?..despite promises to punish looters!

      hehehe you seem to be dodging the question... where was NAB when BB and NS were in power.

      Comment


        #4
        Abdali- no offence, but your lack of knowledge of Pak shows in all your posts.

        NAB was created by the ARMY!

        Nawaz had his own 'witch hunt' unit, i believe it was called the 'Esthab commission'.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by RealDeal:
          Abdali- no offence, but your lack of knowledge of Pak shows in all your posts.

          NAB was created by the ARMY!

          Nawaz had his own 'witch hunt' unit, i believe it was called the 'Esthab commission'.


          Ask me, and I'd say the same about you. Your knowledge about Pak is not more then of a little kid. You see its mutual.. further you are pretty consistent dodging the question. Be my guest and replace NAB with Ihtesab Bureau .. and then tell us what did that bureau did.....


          [This message has been edited by Abdali (edited April 21, 2002).]

          Comment


            #6
            ---------------------------------------------
            Please explain the twin brother of NAB estshabI've hard of this bureau so many times. Why is that NAB is in question but the other is not,, any reason.
            ---------------------------------------------

            ok, Esthasab Commission is not a 'twin brother' of NAB. They are totally seperate.

            Esthsab Comm was set up by NS to 'recover the loot and punish the looters' of previous (read BB) govts. Needless to say, this did not occur. The EC was used to victimise opponents, that's it.

            When NS was dismissed, EC was also gone. Army
            then created National Accountability Bureau
            to 'recover the loot and punish the looters'.

            Of course with NS 'living it up' in SA, and so many corrupt people being in the govt favour when they agree to support Mush, this hasn't occured either.

            NAB, like EC is used to 'victimise' opponents, nothing else.

            Their so called 'purpose' are the same, but they are run by the different people, and can't really be compared.

            Hope that helps.


            Comment


              #7
              heres another example of Mush 'punishing' looters as he promised:
              http://www.dawn.com/2001/12/25/nat17.htm

              A NAB official confirmed that Air Marshal (retd) Waqar Azeem had also been released after his sentence was remitted by President Gen Pervez Musharraf exercising his constitutional powers.

              Mr Azeem was awarded seven years imprisonment in a loan-default case in 2000.


              Comment


                #8
                ok, Esthasab Commission is not a 'twin brother' of NAB. They are totally seperate.

                No they are not, their job is to go after the corrupt.

                Esthsab Comm was set up by NS to 'recover the loot and punish the looters' of previous (read BB) govts. Needless to say, this did not occur. The EC was used to victimise opponents, that's it.

                Nowhere it says Ihtesab Bureau is for BB govt. or the govt. in power is exempt. Beisde by your own admission Ihtesab did nothing….

                When NS was dismissed, EC was also gone. Army
                then created National Accountability Bureau
                to 'recover the loot and punish the looters'.


                So it is the replacement of Ihtesab, same drink new bottle.

                Of course with NS 'living it up' in SA, and so many corrupt people being in the govt favour when they agree to support Mush, this hasn't occured either.

                That is not the point the point is what has Ihtesab done to get the corrupt.

                NAB, like EC is used to 'victimise' opponents, nothing else.
                Their so called 'purpose' are the same, but they are run by the different people, and can't really be compared.
                Hope that helps.


                Sure it will help a lot if you clean up the so called democracy in question rather then ending up sniffing khakis over and over again.

                Comment


                  #9
                  SIGH! Abdlai, seriously do you read what I post? First of all, I have said a number of times I don't like NS/BB and they are not the 'democrats' who should rule Pak!!!!!

                  I know about the content of the article! You don't have to convince me NS was a horrible PM! I have said it myself millions of times!

                  ---------------------------------------------No they are not, their job is to go after the corrupt.
                  ---------------------------------------------

                  Again, did you read what I wrote because I answered this.

                  ---------------------------------------------
                  Nowhere it says Ihtesab Bureau is for BB govt. or the govt. in power is exempt. Beisde by your own admission Ihtesab did nothing….
                  ---------------------------------------------
                  SIGH!!!!! Abdali, Abdali, Abdali!!! First of all, you didn't even now what the EB was till I told you! As for 'not being written', honestly that is very naive of you.

                  ---------------------------------------------
                  So it is the replacement of Ihtesab, same drink new bottle.
                  ---------------------------------------------

                  gotta say, thats a funny line!

                  ---------------------------------------------
                  That is not the point the point is what has Ihtesab done to get the corrupt.
                  ---------------------------------------------

                  I have already said to you EC didn't get the corrupt but was used to victimise opponents,
                  like NAB. All a big farce.

                  ---------------------------------------------
                  Sure it will help a lot if you clean up the so called democracy in question rather then ending up sniffing khakis over and over again.
                  ---------------------------------------------

                  AGAIN, do you really read what I post b4 replying?!!
                  I said many, many times the system needs to be cleaned, needs to develop without the Army bringing it to a screeching halt every few years. Like Jinnah planned, and like all developed countries

                  Comment


                    #10
                    SIGH! Abdlai, seriously do you read what I post? First of all, I have said a number of times I don't like NS/BB and they are not the 'democrats' who should rule Pak!!!!!

                    yeah I’ve hard that before, so find a leader (not a virtual leader) and then talk.

                    I know about the content of the article! You don't have to convince me NS was a horrible PM! I have said it myself millions of times!

                    Since you are one of the biggest democrats you should investigate BB and NS first rather then beating the old drum.

                    Again, did you read what I wrote because I answered this.

                    You bet…..

                    SIGH!!!!! Abdali, Abdali, Abdali!!! First of all, you didn't even now what the EB was till I told you! As for 'not being written', honestly that is very naive of you.

                    Buddy don’t kid yourself I’ve been reading newspapers long enough… Long enough to know what little games these so called democratically elected crooks play.

                    I have already said to you EC didn't get the corrupt but was used to victimise opponents, like NAB. All a big farce.

                    Good so start with NS and BB and then we will look at the army or are those crooks exempted.

                    AGAIN, do you really read what I post b4 replying?!!
                    I said many, many times the system needs to be cleaned, needs to develop without the Army bringing it to a screeching halt every few years. Like Jinnah planned, and like all developed countries


                    hehehe I am sure you are joking when you pin it on the army for every ill of the country. Guess who will be looting again if we go for another election.

                    P.S: FYI there is no such thing as Esthsab Comm I’ve always read about Ihtesab Bureau unless you are talking of something else.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      ---------------------------------------------
                      Good so start with NS and BB and then we will look at the army or are those crooks exempted.
                      --------------------------------------------

                      Is NS exempt? I have never said so, but you should ask that of the Army who let him go.
                      FACT!

                      ---------------------------------------------
                      hehehe I am sure you are joking when you pin it on the army for every ill of the country. Guess who will be looting again if we go for another election.
                      ---------------------------------------------

                      Did I ever say EVERY ill was cuz of the Army?
                      Again you are glossing over what I wrote.
                      I said Army AND politicians are EQUALLY responsible. Be fair yaar!

                      ---------------------------------------------
                      Guess who will be looting again if we go for another election.
                      ---------------------------------------------

                      Guess whose looting now?i have already told you my thoughts, a developing country like Pak needs its institutions to develop!


                      ---------------------------------------------
                      P.S: FYI there is no such thing as Esthsab Comm I’ve always read about Ihtesab Bureau unless you are talking of something else.
                      ---------------------------------------------

                      Semantics, but then if you knew about it as you are now saying, why were you pretending and lying by saying you didn't?!!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Is NS exempt? I have never said so, but you should ask that of the Army who let him go. FACT!
                        Did I ever say EVERY ill was cuz of the Army?
                        Again you are glossing over what I wrote.
                        I said Army AND politicians are EQUALLY responsible. Be fair yaar!


                        You should read your own posts, or would you want me to dig out hundreds of your posts to show you how your sole focus is the ones in uniform.

                        Guess whose looting now?i have already told you my thoughts, a developing country like Pak needs its institutions to develop!

                        Please tell us who is looting, I am not aware of any swiss bank accounts of Mushrraf or his mansion in surrey if you do please let us know. Further since FX are swelling that is a solid indicator of less corruption…

                        Semantics, but then if you knew about it as you are now saying, why were you pretending and lying by saying you didn't?!!

                        Please tell us where I said I never knew about Ihtesab Bureau. This so called little game of NS was known to me from day one only I liked NAB better coz its an abberivation of nabbed

                        Comment


                          #13
                          ---------------------------------------------
                          You should read your own posts, or would you want me to dig out hundreds of your posts to show you how your sole focus is the ones in uniform.
                          ---------------------------------------------

                          Well last time I checked, the 'ones in unifrom' are the ones in govt aren't they?
                          If I am talking about the current situation in Pak, shouldn't I be talking about the current govt? Does that not make sense?

                          ---------------------------------------------
                          Please tell us who is looting, I am not aware of any swiss bank accounts of Mushrraf or his mansion in surrey if you do please let us know.
                          ---------------------------------------------

                          I don't think you heard of Zia's Swiss accounts when he was in power either. Yet when he was 'out of office', his son became one of the richest men in Pak....hhhmmmmm, I wonder how!

                          With the Army total lack of accountability, you will not have the same 'look' as you will with civilan govts. With civilans you can kick uup a fuss, with Army you can't argue over a bribe. There's a reason why corp commanders are known as 'crore commanders'!

                          Besides, NS doesn't have a Surrey mansion, does that mean he wasn't corrupt?....hhhmmm..maybe THAT was why Mush let him go!

                          ---------------------------------------------
                          Further since FX are swelling that is a solid indicator of less corruption…
                          ---------------------------------------------

                          Reports by econmists have already said Mush govt was not responsible for this unprecendted rise. Those reports have been quoted here, I really don't want to go through the reasons AGAIN. Besides as a regular here, you must have read it.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Well last time I checked, the 'ones in unifrom' are the ones in govt aren't they?
                            If I am talking about the current situation in Pak, shouldn't I be talking about the current govt? Does that not make sense?


                            No! since you are the advocate of democracy you should introspect and it starts with BB and NS not the ones in uniforms.

                            I don't think you heard of Zia's Swiss accounts when he was in power either. Yet when he was 'out of office', his son became one of the richest men in Pak....hhhmmmmm, I wonder how!
                            With the Army total lack of accountability, you will not have the same 'look' as you will with civilan govts. With civilans you can kick uup a fuss, with Army you can't argue over a bribe. There's a reason why corp commanders are known as 'crore commanders'!


                            Ah! Guilty until proven innocent, please provide a link to Zia’s swiss accounts. And further great fuss you lot put up when BB and NS were looting left and right.

                            Besides, NS doesn't have a Surrey mansion, does that mean he wasn't corrupt?....hhhmmm..maybe THAT was why Mush let him go!

                            Yeah and BB had one and she isn’t either,,, right…..

                            Reports by econmists have already said Mush govt was not responsible for this unprecendted rise. Those reports have been quoted here, I really don't want to go through the reasons AGAIN. Besides as a regular here, you must have read it.

                            Hey its lot easier to reverse it, just put some thieves incharge and see how it evaporates. NS stole billions by freezing FCA and FX still nose dived to $400M.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Abdali,

                              Democracy does not end at BB and NS. More over BB, NS or anyone else for that matter involved in corruption because of direct link with the army purchases/dealings. For argument sake even if I agree with you, the major source of corruption is still the army. Defense purchases which sometimes are done in billions of $s. People like BB and NS get the very nominal percentage of the deal. The major commissions go to your generals. If they would have been honest in their dealings, I bet even a single penny could be misappropriated by civilians. If they do, they would have been hanged by the military generals. That is One of the major reasons why NS was allowed Scot free to leave the country superseding the decision of Supreme Court of Pakistan and not a single case has been proved against Asif Zaradari. Zardari has now become a seasoned politician. Thanks to your military generals.


                              RealDeal,

                              I totally agree with you.

                              Sincerely
                              FARID

                              Comment

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