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Yanks bugged by Chinese missile aid to Pakistan

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    Yanks bugged by Chinese missile aid to Pakistan

    Looks like Uncle Sam is so keen to cash in on the Indian market they are doing their Nosey-Parker-ing for them. Missile technology is a wonderful thing though. Just as US can implement it's foreign policy by unleashing a few cruise missiles somewhere in the direction of Johnny Foreigner Land, soon this ability will be shared by control freaks the world over. This, I believe, will lead to a new age of reason.

    ================================================== =========================================

    China's aid to Pakistan bomb risks US deal


    The Times 3rd July 2000

    IN A serious blow to President Clinton's hopes of harmonising relations with Beijing, American intelligence agencies have reported that China is continuing to help Pakistan to build long-range missiles that could carry nuclear warheads.
    The reports could jeopardise passage through the Senate of a trade Bill aimed at establishing normal trade relations between China and the US, a necessary precursor to making China a member of the World Trade Organisation by the end of this year.

    An American arms control delegation will leave Washington tomorrow for Beijing to express American concerns that the missile issue is a serious source of discord.

    Members of Congress were told last week, in a series of classified briefings, that China had increased its shipment of special steels, guidance systems and other technical expertise to the Pakistani missile programme, according to American intelligence.

    In addition, Chinese experts were said to have been seen around Pakistan's newest missile factory, which appeared to be based on a Chinese design. China and Pakistan regard themselves as strategic allies, with both looking on India as their greatest regional threat.

    China's missile help has persisted after India's nuclear test, despite assurances from President Jiang Zemin to Mr Clinton that Beijing would review its aid to Pakistan. An unnamed American general, noting the close ties between the Chinese and Pakistani military, told The New York Times: "We're not sure how much is going on that the Chinese hierarchy knows about."

    A congressional official familiar with the latest intelligence said the Pakistanis went to the Chinese and said: "We know you have this agreement with the Americans, but we really need your help."

    The issue is fraught with risks for Mr Clinton, who had been hoping for a diplomatic triumph. Republicans controlling the Senate, uneasy about normalising trade with China, see a chance to embarrass the President in the approach to the American election and also an opportunity to impose sanctions on China if the missile help continues.

    For now, the Republicans are delaying a vote on the trade Bill, which has been passed by the House, and are crafting legislation that would seek to curb China's exports of missile technology.

    One measure under consideration would require Washington to impose automatic sanctions on China if there were "credible evidence" that it was helping other countries to develop or acquire nuclear bombs. This week's mission to Beijing will be led by John Holum, a senior arms control official, with the aim of trying to impress upon the Chinese that an arms race in south Asia is not in China's nor America's interests.

    General Pervez Musharraf, the Pakistani military leader, confirmed at the weekend that his Government was considering buying Chinese jets. He said Pakistan had bought "a large number of commodities" from China.

    ================================================== =========================================

    Extreme Yar as usual you put your point across in the most beautiful of ways! THERE IS ONE COUNTRY IN THE WORLD THAT TERRIFIES BOTH THE USA AND INDIA - THAT IS CHINA! PAK'S BESTEST OF BUDDIES!

    Fact 1 - In 2006 China will overtake Japan and become the 2nd biggest economy in the world!

    Fact 2 - In around 2020 or even before China will overtake the USA and become the NO.1 economy in the world!

    For years and years we have seen these stupid Americans bleeting like lambs about China's terrible human rights record, Falun Gong/religous rights, Tibet, Taiwan etc etc etc - WHY BEACUSE THEY WANT TO WEAKEN CHINA - THEY CAN'T BREAK IT UP INTO SMALL STATES LIKE THE USSR (CHINA IS A HOMOGONEOUS COUNTRY WITH 93% CHINESE-SPEAKERS).

    But these pathetic and weak tactics are failing miserably, and China will not be kept down! its too big and proud a country to be pushed around by the half-literate Americans, who have no idea about history or culture etc.

    Thank God the CE has repaired the relationship with China (that the "Son of Bharat" NS almost ruined), and it seems like China is well aware of the USA's designs and is pushing its relationship with PAK into first gear. We should give support to China on Taiwan and other issues - and establish a true defence and security union with China.

    No only is the USA getting wet over increased Chinese and PAK defence sales, but it is apprehensive over selling anything to India - it is pressuring the Jewish entity not to sell Indian any weapons - obviuosly it does not trust the saffron merchants of New Delhi??

    In fact Israel's position is interesting - it is preapred to sell weapons to India AND China against American objections! It just proves my point of the Zionists. i.e. that they latch onto a growing power to safeguard Jewish interests e.g. upto 1945 it was close to Britain (and France)and then when they became bankrupt it latched onto the USA, and now it is latching onto the other "potential" powers like China (and India?)


    P.S. I know we will get the likes of China-obsessessed Indians like ZZ spitting fire and belittling Great China?

    [This message has been edited by Malik73 (edited July 03, 2000).]


      What are you on prozac???
      Or is it speed??
      That was one hell of a fast paced post.
      In my term paper on Pak FP - the one for class this term, i found it very interesting that the Military govt would always support China and China would back them up in kind.
      Like in the NS kargil episode - China actaully reproached us.
      Yet you have yet to hear a bad word by the Chinese about our beloved CE.
      While with NS the US was all happy and Hunk-dory with the govt even though it was not democractic and corrupt to the core.
      But since the US could dictate terms to NS they were more than happy.
      But since the CE has his own mind and is working for the country's best interests, the US is spitting venom like a spitfire - that is an old WW2 plane.
      So it is good for us to work with China and stay away from the US.

      <B> <Font color=green>PAK-SINO RELATIONS ZINDABAD</font> </b>

      i hope this html works on this site.
      You can't fix stupid. So might as well troll them!


        3 stooges again, telling the world how behind they are? Guys, China stinks, no matter which way you look at it from. The other day, how many, 58?? Deadbodies in the cargo truck? Sure, it has potential to compete with the USA, but not for another 1000 years or so. India stands a much better chance in becoming a global power, equal to that of the USA. Pakistan is still living off on stolen and illegally acquired technology.


          Ah, What an "intellectual" reply from this "ECONOMIST"?

          [This message has been edited by sabah (edited July 04, 2000).]


            Malik says:

            For years and years we have seen these stupid Americans bleeting like lambs about China's terrible human rights record
            Here's a typical conversation between an oil sheikh and Bill Clinton :

            Bill Clinton (BC) "Now mah good friend Mr Sheikh, Ah think we Americayuns, wuhd lahik tuh see you A-rabs doin' suhm Hyoomane Righyuts work in yer lil' ol country. Hows about lettin yer women-folks drive cars fer instunce?"

            Sheikh Bin-ter-Da-Casino :

            "Meester Cleenton; eef you are willing to turn a blind eye to our deeferent customs and our barbaric punishment seestem for ze criminals who mostly turn out to be from ze sub-continent, we will give all ze big building contracts to ze American firms by ze grace of his majesty, King Ahl-Kissya Butt."

            BC : "OK.."



              Bill Clinton is holding a garage sale at the Whitehouse. There's some real bargains to be had. Human Rights is up for sale at the right price, but you'll have to hurry though; heikh Bin-ter-Da-Casino has pots of cash and he reckons Clinton will sell if the price is right!


                Xtreme, if sheiks are buttbackwards, why blame Billy for that? Who do you suppose they should give their building contracts to? They didn’t shy away from Occidental in the 30’s when no one else will dare stand the desert heat. It is the payback for all the hard work my friend. Sheiks still have a lot to pay to the US for all of what US has done for them. Can’t even make a bloody banana-trap (a kinda pipe design found in GOSPs (Gas Oil Separating Plants).



                  Sheiks still have a lot to pay to the US for all of what US has done for them
                  What makes you think that Arabs owe anything to US? Did they do that work for free?

                  Who do you suppose they should give their building contracts to?
                  I agree with you here , I think the US is the best choice. Throw enough dhirams in their direction and they conveniently forget about Human Rights into the bargain!


                    Xtreme, if you check my earlier reply, I never said “Arabs”, I was careful to use “Shiekhs” as there is a big distinction. USA has not done much for Arabs, but Shieks are a different matter altogether. Shieks are a creed within itself. They are so low and so dumbfounded that it is hard to find bigger incognizants as them. I hate to generalize, but all Shieks are pretty stupid in my opinion.


                      "Throw enough dhirams in their direction and they conveniently forget about Human Rights into the bargain!"

                      Yup're absolutely right there !! How do you think China's human rights record gets swept under the carpet ??!

                      By the way...this "largest economy" bull**** is of no consequence -- India has the 5th or 6th largest economy. But thats not a surprise considering the size. So comparing China to countries like Japan/USA is a joke. Their people try their level best to land up in the US for jobs -- this is not the sign of a superpower. (you dont see Germans doing that do you ?) Going by India's slow pace of progress (but for the last 10 years)'ll be some time before India can provide clean drinking water and good healthcare to its citizens...let alone be a superpower. China is better than India in many indicators but they are still far behind many other countries, let alone US. For all their so called progress they still lag behind countries like Sri Lanka in the human development index. Let them compete with Sri Lanka first and then talk about the US.

                      This is not an attempt to belittle China -- I think its a great nation and there is a lot to learn from them -- specially the way they treat seperatist movements in their country !!


                        Ahmadi - avoid your usual diversionary tactics and be an "ECONOMIST" for a change - tell us why you think China can't match the USA in 1000 years??

                        BombayKid - China will NOT have the same living standards as the USA in 2020 BUT WILL HAVE A BIGGER GDP! i.e. largest economy in the world buddy??? Some simple facts for you:-

                        USA - Population 275 million
                        China - Population 1275 million!

                        i.e. The average American could be 5 times richer than the average Chinese BUT China would still become the biggest economy in the world! i.e. No.1 - its already more than 50% of the way there!!

                        USA GDP (1998) - $8.511 trillion
                        CHINA GDP (1998) - $4.42 trillion
                        INDIA (1998) - $1.689 trillion




                          Bombaykid says:

                          I think its a great nation and there is a lot to learn from them -- specially the way they treat seperatist movements in their country !!
                          Careful BK...I sense there's a closet fundo waiting to get out!


                            No "closet fundo" within me, Mr. Xtreme -- what you see is what you get !! I don't beat around the bush like others and I don't use sugar coated language and talk about non-existant friendships and cultural similarities. I also don't like to put the entire blame on politicians on our problems...I think there is genuine hate between our people and the politicians are not always to be blamed. My views are not politically correct and I dont care whether others think of me as a fundo.

                            By the don't by any chance think that China's methods in dealing with seperatist movements are wrong, do you ?!!

                            Malik...these figures don't impress me. There are lots of people in India who are proud of India's $1.7 trillion GDP -- does it matter -- hell no !! Why ? Because countries like India and China have populations well above a whats impressive about our GDPs. Look at the GDPs of the US, Japan, Germany and thats something to be impressed about (given their populations).

                            Lets ask our friendly local economist (N.Y. Ahmedi) why India's or China's GDPs are not impressive and maybe we'll get a good idea.

                            [This message has been edited by BombayKid (edited July 03, 2000).]


                              Malik, China today has 4 times as many people as the US. Why can’t they be the greatest today? Why 2020? Is that a magic year?

                              There are countries with 1/0th the population of Pakistan, with a lot bigger GDP and lot more robust economies. Population argument is frail. Bigger population in China means greater consumption of already scarce resources, not less.

                              Until China abandons its centralized control on resources, it can not match even Argentina, let alone the USA.