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    Kabul under Taliban and our interests

    Under Taliban rule :

    There will be no place for bloach insurgents in Afghanistan.

    Security situation in KPK and Blochistan will improve. (From1997 to 2001 when Taliban ruled Afghanistan, these two provinces were the most peaceful provinces of Pakistan)

    In the absence of a nationalist afghan gov, the anti-Pakistan movements like PTM will eventually die out.

    Racist afgans will find no place in Afghanistan to mislead our Pakistani pashtuns (which they have been doing since the exit of Taliban in 2001)

    The nexus between Afgan security forces and Indian intelligence will be broken for good.

    India's billions of dollars investment in Afghanistan will go in vain and Indians will be forced to stop their activities from Afghan soil.


    well it's a win-win situation for Pakistan. Don't know why we are still reluctant to acknowledge these facts. We need to see our interests first, and that's it. No need to worry about human or women rights.

    #2
    I still don’t think Americans are leaving. They are only changing their focus to address a more immediate concern and will refocus on their unfinished business in Afghanistan sometime down the road. In 1991, the US left Iraq only because it had to laser focus on Soviet Union. Those efforts led to the collapse of Soviet Union. Meanwhile the US made sure to keep Iraq smoldering with sanctions and bombs until going in once again in 2003. The day Bush won the election, an old uncle in my neighborhood claimed that Bush would finish what his father had started in Iraq. I think the US is going to do something big against China now, and only that’s why slowing things down in Afghanistan. But will refocus on Afghanistan once China is taken care of. Meanwhile, the US will keep Afghanistan smoldering with sanctions and bombs. I’ve heard from the news that surveillance drones are flying all over Afghanistan these days in huge numbers, possibly identifying targets to raid once ordered. Wikileaks told us how drones use data from mobile phone networks to find it’s targets and since all that infrastructure is still there, no wonder there is all that reluctance. Also, Pakistan is effectively kept under sanctions through FATF and inclusion of Pakistan in the child soldier list by the US indicates that picture abhi baaqi hai.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by decentGuy View Post
      I still don’t think Americans are leaving. They are only changing their focus to address a more immediate concern and will refocus on their unfinished business in Afghanistan sometime down the road. In 1991, the US left Iraq only because it had to laser focus on Soviet Union. Those efforts led to the collapse of Soviet Union. Meanwhile the US made sure to keep Iraq smoldering with sanctions and bombs until going in once again in 2003. The day Bush won the election, an old uncle in my neighborhood claimed that Bush would finish what his father had started in Iraq. I think the US is going to do something big against China now, and only that’s why slowing things down in Afghanistan. But will refocus on Afghanistan once China is taken care of. Meanwhile, the US will keep Afghanistan smoldering with sanctions and bombs. I’ve heard from the news that surveillance drones are flying all over Afghanistan these days in huge numbers, possibly identifying targets to raid once ordered. Wikileaks told us how drones use data from mobile phone networks to find it’s targets and since all that infrastructure is still there, no wonder there is all that reluctance. Also, Pakistan is effectively kept under sanctions through FATF and inclusion of Pakistan in the child soldier list by the US indicates that picture abhi baaqi hai.
      Though i do think United States can carry out air strikes on selected locations and targets in Afghanistan in near future, but i don't think they will repeat the mistake of launching ground assaults. And this will ultimately benefit Pakistan because in the absence of foreign forces in Afghanistan, India will have no space to destabilize Pakistan.
      Right now things are really heated up at international level. Web of lies, proxies, sanctions every thing is being used as a tool to pressurise smaller countries to take sides and given the current tensions between different countries and the urge to prove superiority over rivals, World War III looks set to begin within a few years.
      Last edited by Pakistani Prince; 3 weeks ago.

      Comment


        #4
        This is not the first time that Taliban would rule Afghanistan. They were in power before 2001 too. Then too we supported them fully. What happened next is history.

        It is a fantasy that Taliban would rule happily ever after. We just have no business getting involved at all. Should cease all support we are giving to the Taliban and let Afghans sort out things among themselves.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by krash View Post
          This is not the first time that Taliban would rule Afghanistan. They were in power before 2001 too. Then too we supported them fully. What happened next is history.

          It is a fantasy that Taliban would rule happily ever after. We just have no business getting involved at all. Should cease all support we are giving to the Taliban and let Afghans sort out things among themselves.
          If you don't like talibans, that's another thing but don't speak lies here. When Taliban ruled Afghanistan from 1997 to 2001, all kind of foreign violence in Pakistan came to an end and Pakistan became the most peaceful country in the region, no suicide bombings, no violence at all.

          Before and After Taliban rule, there were suicide bombings, killings, attacks, anti pak sentiments and what not. The afghans who today are fighting the Taliban have always ditched us, abused us, sided with India, allowed India to carry out anti Pakistan activities, tried to trigger our pashtuns against us. Why would we side with such people in the name of democracy or human rights lol ? It's friends Vs foes and if we ever have to pick a side, we will choose the ones who are beneficial for us.

          You can keep your eyes shut like a pigeon but there are some proven facts that need no validation from anyone. If Talibans come to power again, half of our security problems will be solved because most of our security problems come from Indian-Afghan nexus.
          Last edited by Pakistani Prince; 3 weeks ago.

          Comment


            #6
            How long did that peace and quiet last? What we suffered after 2001 was the terrible blowback of supporting a regime that was sheltering Al-Qaeda. The other Afghans wouldn't have anything against us if we weren't supporting Taliban in the first place.
            How long will Taliban last this time? They will be permanently at war with more than half their country even if they dominate by force. Do we really want to take sides in that war? What will happen if the Taliban are eventually overthrown? Have we really learned nothing from our mistakes?

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Pakistani Prince View Post

              Though i do think United States can carry out air strikes on selected locations and targets in Afghanistan in near future, but i don't think they will repeat the mistake of launching ground assaults. And this will ultimately benefit Pakistan because in the absence of foreign forces in Afghanistan, India will have no space to destabilize Pakistan.
              Right now things are really heated up at international level. Web of lies, proxies, sanctions every thing is being used as a tool to pressurise smaller countries to take sides and given the current tensions between different countries and the urge to prove superiority over rivals, World War III looks set to begin within a few years.
              Although it is good to wish for the best case scenarios, planning however should take into account worst case scenarios as well. What the US did in FATA, could be done in Afghanistan as well to facilitate India. If you remember, several attempted peace deals b/w government of Pakistan and TTP were scuttled by US drone strikes. As a result the situation in Pakistan got so bad that there were 5 to 6 bomb blasts daily, which gave the US even more leverage over Pakistan to do things that were not in the interest of Pakistan. And India took full advantage of the ensuing chaos, as any sensible opponent would. India established nearly 24 consulates in Afghanistan next to the border with Pakistan to wreak havoc in Pakistan all the while with full knowledge of the US. I remember how happy some of my Indian colleagues were at that time. Before every cricket match, ordinary Indians had started to harass and mock Pakistanis. Several Indian TV shows were doing the same with Pakistani guests. I remember how in one show even Shahrukh Khan was insulting Shahid Afridi and the rest of the team on their face.

              US and India are strategic partners. For example, the US barely allows Pakistan to acquire spare parts for F16s but has officially offered to start manufacturing F16s in India. There are lots of other areas which signify the strategic nature of the partnership. The reason I’m bringing all that up is to emphasize that facilitating the US in Afghanistan was and is equivalent to facilitating India. I hope the planners in Pakistan recognize that.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by krash View Post
                How long did that peace and quiet last? What we suffered after 2001 was the terrible blowback of supporting a regime that was sheltering Al-Qaeda.
                Sorry that's untrue. What we suffered after 2001 was not blowback of supporting Taliban, it was blowback of joining America's war on terror and brutally and inhumanly bombing our own civilians and tribal people. Pakistan was peaceful and there were no suicide bombings until pervez Musharraf decided to send army to Wazirastan in 2004, which turned out to be a huge blunder.

                Originally posted by krash View Post
                The other Afghans wouldn't have anything against us if we weren't supporting Taliban in the first place.
                Looks like you think we all are living in stone age and you can get away with telling lies in broad day light on this forum lol. The afghans you are referring to have always been against us even when there was no war in Afghanistan. They voted against our existence in UN in 1947 and went on to host bloach insurgents in early 70s. Khair Bakash Murree and many other bloach leaders ran anti-pak groups from Afganistan in 70s. We supported afghan militant groups much later. And the issue of durind line is now part of afghan curriculum in which children are being told that the area from Chaman (blochistan) to attock (Punjab) was part of greater afghanistan and Pakistan forcefully occupied it lol. The fact is, the hatred Afghans have for us has nothing to do with our involvement in Afghanistan from 80 onwards, and a nationalist Afghan government in Afghanistan will always pose a great threat to our existence even if we support them in their war against Taliban.
                The only time we had peaceful relations with Afghanistan was when Taliban ruled Afghanistan.

                Originally posted by krash View Post
                How long will Taliban last this time? They will be permanently at war with more than half their country even if they dominate by force.
                Nothing lasts forever man, everything comes to an end eventually but as long as Talibans rule Afghanistan, the indian-afghan nexus will not traslate into terrorist activities against us and we can breath a sigh of relief.

                Originally posted by krash View Post
                Do we really want to take sides in that war? What will happen if the Taliban are eventually overthrown?
                Don't take sides if you dont want, but if Taliban come to power, we should not boycott them. Instead we need to cash this opportunity to wipe out activities happening against us from Afghan soil, by establishing friendly relations with Taliban.

                Originally posted by krash View Post
                Have we really learned nothing from our mistakes?
                That's what i am asking, have we learned from our mistakes ? We stayed neutral in china-India war in 1962 when the stage was set for Ayoub Khan to attack J&K. Later on we paid a heavy price when India decided not to stay neural in 1971 Estern-Western Pakistan war lol. When will we stop being "Morally Good" and pursue our own interests like other smart countries?
                Last edited by Pakistani Prince; 3 weeks ago.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by decentGuy View Post

                  Although it is good to wish for the best case scenarios, planning however should take into account worst case scenarios as well. What the US did in FATA, could be done in Afghanistan as well to facilitate India. If you remember, several attempted peace deals b/w government of Pakistan and TTP were scuttled by US drone strikes. As a result the situation in Pakistan got so bad that there were 5 to 6 bomb blasts daily, which gave the US even more leverage over Pakistan to do things that were not in the interest of Pakistan. And India took full advantage of the ensuing chaos, as any sensible opponent would. India established nearly 24 consulates in Afghanistan next to the border with Pakistan to wreak havoc in Pakistan all the while with full knowledge of the US. I remember how happy some of my Indian colleagues were at that time. Before every cricket match, ordinary Indians had started to harass and mock Pakistanis. Several Indian TV shows were doing the same with Pakistani guests. I remember how in one show even Shahrukh Khan was insulting Shahid Afridi and the rest of the team on their face.

                  US and India are strategic partners. For example, the US barely allows Pakistan to acquire spare parts for F16s but has officially offered to start manufacturing F16s in India. There are lots of other areas which signify the strategic nature of the partnership. The reason I’m bringing all that up is to emphasize that facilitating the US in Afghanistan was and is equivalent to facilitating India. I hope the planners in Pakistan recognize that.
                  Planners in Pakistan are stupid and idiot. In fact, i doubt if there is any institution for planning in the first place. All the planning is done by army generals who move out to US and West along with families after retirement. How can we expect them to take tough decisions?
                  The land of pure is betrayed by its inhabitants countless times since its existence.
                  Last edited by Pakistani Prince; 3 weeks ago.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Our Interior Minister says 'Taliban are now cultured'
                    (Means ' ab woh chaiay main biskut dabo kay naheen khatay)

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Anwer Pasha

                      Taliban have indeed learned a lot. Almost all their recent takeovers have been without a fight. For example, just 4 Taliban representatives on two motorcycles negotiated the takeover of Wakhan Corridor (Area bordering Tajikistan, China and Pakistan). Ismaeli people mostly live there, and Taliban were able to strike a deal.

                      In many districts Afghan soldiers were not paid their salaries for the last 6 months so they don't care about Ashraf Ghani anymore and Taliban have offered them much better options. I hope all Afghans stay in peace and there is no infighting:

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by krash View Post
                        This is not the first time that Taliban would rule Afghanistan. They were in power before 2001 too. Then too we supported them fully. What happened next is history.

                        It is a fantasy that Taliban would rule happily ever after. We just have no business getting involved at all. Should cease all support we are giving to the Taliban and let Afghans sort out things among themselves.
                        ^^This.

                        And Indians are biggest losers in this Afghan conflict.
                        "Har Koi Deta Hai Zakham Gin Gin Kay ....
                        Mein Kis Kis Zakham Ko Apna Naseeb Samjhoon"
                        By Royal Gala

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by decentGuy View Post
                          Anwer Pasha

                          Taliban have indeed learned a lot. Almost all their recent takeovers have been without a fight. For example, just 4 Taliban representatives on two motorcycles negotiated the takeover of Wakhan Corridor (Area bordering Tajikistan, China and Pakistan). Ismaeli people mostly live there, and Taliban were able to strike a deal.

                          In many districts Afghan soldiers were not paid their salaries for the last 6 months so they don't care about Ashraf Ghani anymore and Taliban have offered them much better options. I hope all Afghans stay in peace and there is no infighting:
                          Let's see
                          But action in Pakistan is coming
                          Today a grenades' attack on girl students

                          Panic as grenade hurled at girls school in N. Waziristan
                          Police say miscreants threw a hand grenade at the watchtower of the school.

                          انسانیت کے دشمن ، تعلیم کے دشمن ، خواتین کے دشمن ، معاشرے اور سماج کے دشمن طالبان پھر ایکٹو ہو گئے پاکستان میں حملوں کا آغاز کر دیا

                          URDU.GEO.TV
                          شمالی وزیرستان: 12ویں جماعت کی طالبات کے پرچے کے دوران اسکول پر دستی بم حملہ
                          گورنمنٹ ہائی اسکول پر دستی بم حملے سے جانی نقصان کی اطلاع نہیں ملی: پولیس
                          Last edited by Anwer Pasha; 2 weeks ago.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Anwer Pasha View Post

                            Let's see
                            But action in Pakistan is coming
                            Today a grenades' attack on girl students
                            Even a motorcycle stolen is blamed on Taliban. I read that Indians distributed fake pamphlets from Taliban around their consulate in Kandahar few days ago. The pamphlets asked each household to provide details of women in the household so that Taliban can make them sex slaves. Similar things were done by the Americans as well when they planted nude magazines in Taliban hideouts and later showed that to journalists. A little bit of cross-examination is all it takes to reveal the truth. Doing stuff like contaminating water supply and then pinning it on Taliban is quite common. I don't blame Americans or Indians, such tactics are quite effective in building local support so local militia could be setup to take on Taliban.


                            Comment


                              #15
                              This is what the entire world was predicting, emboldened Jihadis and Pakistan will face the blow back. Parties like TTP n TLP will be fully energised cocked n ready.
                              Terrorists attacked a team of Pakistan Army, killing a captain and 11 soldiers in the Khyber Pakhtunkhwa province.

                              Comment


                              • Pakistani Prince
                                Pakistani Prince commented
                                Editing a comment
                                That's fake news, never quote anything from indian media. Only 2 soldiers were martyred in an operation in kurram agency. And this incident has nothing to do with people fighting Indian and afghan forces.

                              • Bobby1
                                Bobby1 commented
                                Editing a comment
                                Washington Post had an article about how victory in Afghanistan will embolden Isamists in Pakistan,, Imran's statements suggest that also other world leaders. Pakistan will be spinning news until your head will spin. They are calling the bus attack a gas leak, China is calling it an attack. Is China fake news also?
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