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The value of a university education?

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    The value of a university education?

    I was just having a heated discussion with a friend the other day about the value of going to university.

    Amazingly, and most astonishingly to myself, we ended up deciding that there is very little that you gain at uni that you can't gain elsewhere in life. Lets face it- most (excluding vocational) degrees are totally irrelevant to working life- you just memorize more facts.

    For example a friend of mine is studying a degree in History, and the whole of his degree focusses on the Middle Ages- what value is that? Most people I know who are earning big bucks got degrees in totally unrelated subjects to their working field, which makes the issue even more wierd.

    I feel sad that education nowadays seems to focus only on conveying knowledge and not the wisdom associated with it. And the knowledge isn't that important anyway, so why do it? I don't think you develop as a person that much at uni because of your degree- do you? I mean. wouldn't you mature anyway?

    Am I making sense or am I just stark raving bonkers? What does everyone else think?

    [This message has been edited by TripleA (edited January 23, 2001).]

    Well nothing like a real world education to show you how it really is but you are exposed to many more subjects in a university setting. Just more resources be it in the classroom or just ‘chillin’ with friends…

    I remembering wondering(usually after the tests) why premeds have to learn physics and calculus, but really I think that it changes your style of thinking and the way you tackle problems

    They say some people go to college seeking a degree while the smart people go to college seeking an education…


      I dont' see anything wrong with studying something which will (hopefully) have u earning the big bucks.

      The way i look at it, my univ fee is so friggin' high i sure as anything better end up with a good paying job to make dad's money all its worthwhile!! & i bet a lot of others would agree with me...then again, who wouldn't?

      but u know TripleA, in my eyes, wisdom & knowledge are to seperate things. I sure would not count on many univs to have taught you what wisdom is....knowledge yes, but not wisdom.


        according to somebody, *scratches head* .. man's age should have been 400 years ..

        no no, dont jump yettttt

        1. first hundred, to RECEIVE the wisdom/knowledge/education etc.
        2. second hundred to UNDERSTAND it...
        3. third hundred to practically utalize it / implement it.
        4. fourth (and last hundred) to teach it/multiply it...

        now when all u r left with is an age of like 50 years.. i don't think u r left with the option to get wise or get education or make it work... most of us usually wanna make it work.. so dad's hard earned money (or if me, my own) doesn't go wasted...

        most of our young generation (sounds like buddha now ) these days, usually take the second path .. to put the education money into work .. but i guess, todays' society IS LIKE THAT .. warna wo dinn bhee thay ke sahaaba apnay parents say poochtay thay ke kiya ijaazat milay gi madina/mekkah jaa kar Huzoor (PBUH) ke sath ilm seekhnay ki? (amoomann poori zindagi ki ijaazat) ..

        aur ab dekh lain, howard, princton, berkley, standford har koee bhaagnay ki karta hay .. par .. ahmmmmmmmm .. (-, ilm/hadees/quran say kisee ko lagao nahin bacha ................

        Never frown, even when your are sad,because you never know who is falling in love with your smile.
        Ba'Qalam-e-khud, deewaan'e-gs say baraah'e-raast, Jang Bahaadur Nawaab'e-Lucknow Shaan'e-Brampton Miyaan Shamsheer-ul-Faizy(H.R.H.H.Mister confused)


          I remember sitting in a class (geometry to be precise) all year long thinking how and in what ways the useless theorems and proofs would ever help me out in real life. However, when I graduated from that class at the end of that year with flying colors, and as I stood there holding my report card with a big A on there, did I truly realize, that despite the fact that I strongly disliked that subject, the grade was not so much a grade but an assurace that any problem and any difficulty can be tackled. And I think that's the most valuable thing that Geometry (my most depised subject) has taught me. Since then I have observed that all the courses in one way or another (even the vocational ones) are designed to not only prepare us for professional career-oriented life, but to also help us develop as individuals with our own identities and thoughts. We learn a lot, but because studies take up such a vast amount of time, many a times we don't get to apply and observe our full potential till we have graduated and have been unleased unto the real world.


            Value of Degree (or Value of Education? regardless of university or college).

            If u are studying to gain knowledge then I think its really good thinking but if u are getting education to make money then I wont agree much with it.

            I have a honours in physics and an honours in Law (ya I BSc & B.A, two compelete separate degrees). I studied law to gain knowledge and I studied physics to get a job but amazingly I jumped in IT eleven years ago(while studying physics) and then I did a Masters later on to make myself proficient in the IT field.

            I did masters for my job which didn't/doesn't help me much. Obviously my BSc Hons in physics is not helping me much with my job either, a physicist has nothing to do with Sun Server or Cisco equipment. But studying law broadened the horizons of my way of thinking (I am not talking about Penal or Procedural codes). I even thought of doing M.A in Jurisprudence but now time doesn't allow me to do that.

            Now Value of degree. First of all its a piece of paper which can give u some assistance in getting a job or convincing other people that u might be a bit better than them that u did an effort to get that piece of paper.

            Value of Education/knowledge. It is far more than the paper value of degree. You learn how to live a life u know what your rights are and what u can get out of your life. (It doesn't matter what discipline u get ur education in).


            I would summerize with, one should get the university education (if possible) but not with a point of view of getting it from the best institution & with an intention of getting a job after that (though I did my masters with these intentions) but should be done with the intention of gaining knowledge (BTW I am compeletely against for pushing children to be a doctor or Engineer or lawyer ... let them choose what they want).


            [This message has been edited by Najim (edited January 24, 2001).]


              Why planning to drop out & nees xcuses eh??


                lol funkyDesi,
                Don't think so (TripleA is a medical student, University of Oxford). Just thought it was a serious point- many other students are disillusioned despite being brilliant academics


                  hmmm... excellent topic although it should be in the Career Forum. i'm gonna reply and then move it to the Career Section.

                  I've been through a similar dilemma at more than one point in time. I'm an undegrad myself at the Univ. of Toronto... specialist in Software Engineering and minor in Math.
                  Besides my degree, I have a bunch of professional certifications which in turn have fetched me great contract jobs throughout the Univ. and eased the burden of tuition on me etc.

                  This is where the dilemma comes in. I've earned a quite handsome amount just by completing those cerifications and I'm sure if I pursued the opportunitites more seriously, I could get a high-paying job just on the basis of what I have outside the Univ.

                  I've thought about this not once not twice but so many times.
                  Similarly, others with me also believe that more specialized vocational or technical training is the key to finding a job. I now however tend to disagree.

                  I think the value of a Univ. education is not in what you study but more in what you learn. The communications and critical thinking skills are more important than specific job skills such as computer competency.
                  Here's a concrete example. These days I'm working on a contract with a bunch of programmers. Most of them are Certified Sun Programmers. When it comes to designing a solution, they're simply blank. However, when I tell them this is how you'll do it... they can work just fine! see what I mean. Alhamdullilah I can say that if not anything else, the hard work at Univ pays maybe not in the short-term but the long-term.

                  The certifications that I have... I tend to study two nights and write the exam and two months later I forget everything about it, whereas there's no way I'm ever gonna forget the details of logic and issues in Software Design etc. cuz the foundation's been built.

                  Also the image of liberal arts grads - "would you like fries with that!" is one which the public is accountable for.
                  I like the U of T slogan which goes somefin like:
                  Not all History grads get jobs - they run their own businesses

                  Finally, to rest my point,
                  the public’s image of liberal arts and sciences graduates as "unemployed PhD’s and literature majors serving cappuccinos" simply doesn’t square with reality. Research shows that the average history graduate, for example, has a similar earnings pattern and salary level to graduates in architecture or biochemistry.

                  [This message has been edited by Umar Talib (edited January 25, 2001).]
                  For reason, ruling alone, is a force confining - and passion, unattended, is a flame that burns to its own destruction - Khalil Gibran


                    What university education teaches you is how to tackle problems..

                    my advisor (dean) had this to say on my university graduation ceremony
                    'now you have graduated from college your education begins'

                    the other words of wisdom he had for me were.. take humanities courses.. because when a recruiter comes to find a placement they go to college of arts and science to find the engineers (well i am an engineer).. as they can get a computer programme to solve problems... but they need a person to fill the job.. and A&S teaches you about life and changes the attitude slightly

                    it changed mine..