Parents Beating lil Girls?

[FurQan from Toronto]

Why is it that parents from india or pakistan are againts their kids dating and its ok if guys date? I know this girl, from toronto, she was dating this muslim guy and, and over the march break, her parents took her back to india, and FORCED her to marry some idot who she didint see b4, because her parents found out she was going out with someone in toronto. But before she got married, she got really pissed and told her parents off, and her parents gave her the beatings of the life. When she came back, Her face was all bruised, burnt marks on her neck and scared neck, and limping legs. I saw her, and she was a good friend of mine, i couldnt help it, but i started crying, cuz the girl was only 16 years old.
Why cant parents go with their sons/daughters choice? Are you one of them who will become one of Parents and treat their kids like She got treated?

[PG]

I believe this intereference of parents is due to the fact that divorces are tough and life of divorced woman is a pity in desi society.

Now this makes parents very cautious to see if the marriage will work. A 16 year old girl is unlikely to make a very correct judgement is that respect. In fact, very rarely I have seen a case in which young girl has made a judgement and it worked.

On the other hand a 24-25 year old girls make good judgements and decision, often better than their parents would make.

If another marriage after one failure is easier and society is more tolerent to mistake, (at least as tolerent as they are with men) parents may have better attitude to girl kids choice.

Given that all 'sharief adami' are looking for 'vergin gals', why would parents spoil the future of the girl by allowing her to date.
Younger generation has to improve its attitude. Older people will respond.

[This message has been edited by PG (edited March 21, 1999).]

[Muzna]

To a certain degree I will have to agree with PG that both girls and boys are not always in a position to make informed decisions regarding their future at a very young age.

However, in the example quoted by Furqan, the punishment certainly did not suit the crime. In fact, I would have to insist that there is no reason whatsoever to use physical reprimand or discipline.

[hmcq]

Agree with Muzna,
physical punishment is simply wrong.. all it does is show that "might is right even when wrong"

[PG]

I agree that forced marriage part in the above example is bad. However, none of those guys who are mourning for women's rights to date are going to marry a divorced girl or even the girl who has dated before with an open mind. I know so many sweet and nice girls who got in a wrong decision and divorced. For a hypocrite modernist that I am, I will never even think of marrying them. And it is her parents who will suffer while seeing the situation of their kid. Not the outside liberals.

[sonya]

i agree with muzna and hmcq
girls around that age are still relatively young to make such major decisions regarding their future ... and it is indeed tough for a divorced woman to survive in a desi society,as people have a tendency to talk and it will affect her parents indirectly.however the punishment for the said"crime"is rather uncalled for as a 16yr old girl is not exactly young .i think there are many other solutions to the problem like explaining to the girl tht at this age she should be studying...and not otherwise

[sonya]

i agree with muzna and hmcq
girls around that age are still relatively young to make such major decisions regarding their future ... and it is indeed tough for a divorced woman to survive in a desi society,as people have a tendency to talk and it will affect her parents indirectly.however the punishment for the said"crime"is rather uncalled for as a 16yr old girl is not exactly young .i think there are many other solutions to the problem like explaining to the girl tht at this age she should be studying...and not otherwise

[KK]

sonya, this repition of posts, is it to put more wazan and zor in your argument???

[KK]

sonya, this repition of posts, is it to put more wazan and zor in your argument???

[NYAhmadiX]

My head is spinning; I am reading twice (twice). If you live in North America or Europe, you can report such instances to Police. If you live in Pakistan, you can report such instances to Dar-ulAman. DarulAman is a shelter in Pakistan for women who are victim or abuse at home by parents, husbands, in-laws, etc. When a man even thinks about raising his hand to demean a woman, he should be put away for life. I have more sympathy for murderers, than for people who use physical force against girls (not to suggest that girls are in anyway weaker physically, but you get the point). The only reason for such treatment of girls in our society is "jahiliat" and patriarchal structure of our culture. A recent study by CIRC (a Canadian research outfit) in Pakistan suggests that over 80% instances of female abuse were reported from households where a male member is in-charge of decision-making. This is the same %age of households from where females are not sent to schools for basic education.

[jewels of insignificance]

would someone throw more light on how to actually deal with this situation?
everyone condemns it and theres no use of doing it again until we get to find out a possible solution to the problem.


a girl my age (18), once saw me playing with a band at a local school function and calls me secretly. she tells me of how her father stabbed her head with a knife for not wearing a scarf to school.
or other equally depressing and unbelievable incidents.


i talked to her psychiatrist ( she goes to one) and well he wants me to atleats keep talking to her, if not help her out. she listens to me more than she listens to anyone else. but i dont know what to tell her. i cant tell her i am as helpless as herself.


uptil now, i have been teaching her to compromise. let some things go our way, and accept some things which go against our will. and she's somehow learned that. she no longer thinks what every other teenager like her does. she no longer hates life.

but i know i dont want her to look down and avoid her dad for some time when he's angry.
to tell you the truth, if her dad slaps her, i want her to slap right back at him!

[msaqibj]

Dealinig with the situatuations like this is becoming more and more common among the Muslims living in western countries. In my views beating lil girls or guys would not resolve this problem for either party. Beating your kids (girls or guys)should not be allowed and acceptable in any society. Beating woule never be the solution of the problem. Problems like this need more communication and understanding among parents and kids. Parents need to be the role model for their kids because this type of problems arise more commonly among those family where either parents are not role model for their kids or there is a lack of communication inside the family as well. I don't think beating would bring any betters. The wise parents deal the situation with understanding and intelligence. Teaching your kids the religion and values from the begining along with practicing on these values by yourself would be one of the solutions to deal with the problems like this. Parents need to know that after having kids, there responsibilities have increased too. And ignoring these responsibilities from the begining would bring more sorrows in the situation later than doing any thing better.
My advice to those parents who ignored their responsibilities before and now they are facing this type of situations is that there is always room for improvement to bring the pleasant moments back into the family. Become a friend to your kids as soon as possible. Show that you care your kids more than yourslef. Ignore your own needs and try to fulfill your kids needs first and bring it into your kids notice that you have ignored your own need to meet your kids desire in a very polite and happy manner. In this way your kids would be ready to listen to you more openly and more frankly with kool mind.
The bottom line is that "to make your kids listen to you, you would have to change yourself first".

------------------
Promoting Islam and Pakistan positively won't insult your intelligence.

[Chandni]

I agree with the above response 100%. It has been well put.
I also like to comment that forced marriages always break up one way or another, sooner or later. In many situations, the girl ends seeking love and attention from men other than her husband--affair.
The parents might think that they are doing the girl a favor by getting her married off, but in fact they are just putting their so called "izzat" in more jeopardy when the girl ends up being divorced or having an affair.

The solution: I believe that if the parents don't want their kids to grow up to be "westernized", then they should start teaching their young ones (at age 4) more about Islam and our cultural values.

Parent's should teach their kids about peer pressure, and give physical love to their kids (hugs and kisses). I believe that many Pakistani families refrain from hugging their kids (especially girls) when they reach age 10 or older. Therefore, kids end up looking for affection outside of their home. And the cycle starts...

Been there! My sympathies go out to the girl.

[jewels of insignificance]

when will we stop changing the religion to suit our social practices?why is a girl physically punished in the name of religion.
well i wanted to discuss the religious aspect, but i cant do that because of the tough zero tolerance policy
but i strongly believe, and can prove it, that beating of children is STRICTLY prohibited in islam, and always produces NEGATIVE results.


but they have to beat her up to tell her she is insignificant... she doesnt matter, she is to be played with, and cant do anything in return.
i wrote a poem on this but wont be able to post it because of the strict policy of the forums.
but i would be ineteresting to tell you that i derived my nick from that poem.
black jewels,
of insignificance!

[PG]

Question is not if it is Islamic practice or religious or whatever. I am sure no sensible person will disagree that beating girls is bad.

But then why so much blame is being put on parents. They know that *desi girl does not have a second chance as far as marriage is concerned* and the choices of 16 year old girls are often some 35 year old tailer who already has two kids, and the reason is he talks sooo sweet and looks sooo nice. What do parents do if they do not interfere with her choice.

Forced marriage part in above example is ugly and does no good to the girl, but as far as parents trying to break existing relationship, I will do it if I am convinced if my daughter is going for a completely incompatible person.

Let me repeat my point that if the society takes such things a bit easy and allow a few mistakes of girls, as much as they allow of guys, parents will be less harsh.

Of course, I do agree with Chandni that in general there is a big gap between parents and child in desi families. I am sure our parents love us. But I do not agree what is the point in expressing it in big way. Expressing it matters. Not expressing it makes the kid look outside for love and affection.

[This message has been edited by PG (edited March 24, 1999).]