Inside and outside

[Mr Xtreme]

From one of the discussions going on in the Arts section:

originally posted by Kabir:
manto wrote things about which we all think and are there
in our hearts and minds but we all dont say and express in public. manto was not hypocrite .

The subject was about an urdu writer, Manto, but I can't read urdu so no point in commenting on that. But what do you people think about this notion that we don't say in public what we really feel in our hearts and minds? And do you think we should?

[Asma44]

We should scream at the top of our lungs!

[Sadi Sobi]

I agree utterly with Manto (even tho i've never read his stuff). I've learnt that the only person that u can trust in life is mans best friend - his soul.

[Mariah]

If it is gonna change things for the better, and force us to look at reality, then yes, I feel things should be said..even though these things dont wanna be heard.

But one must be careful when expressing these ideas because, certain societies may not agree, thus causing problems. e.g an Egyptian author, Nawal El Sadawi, was taken arrested cuz of certain contents in her books, which were seen as unbefitting.

It all depends on what you can get away with, and the more truth the better.

[confused]

well i agree to the part that he wasn't a hypo..... all his novels and stories and films contained stuff about society's concerns/issues and points that were RUNING the society.. so i guess, in a way he WAS doing a right thing .. its just that not many people agreed with his style.. and ways he showed the TRUTH..

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Never frown, even when your are sad,because you never know who is falling in love with your smile.

[Mr Xtreme]

Perhaps I should mention that the book was supposedly quite explicit (called thanda gosht) so you might want to take that into account.

I'll give my opinion later when some of the big shots from across the water have woken up and given their take on it.

[Muzna]

Some things should never, ever be said.

[NYAhmadiX]

Xtremo, Just got in at work, but I have to do a lot of crap here before I can say a few words on Gupshup. Work is sucky these days and I get very little time to really go on Gupshup. Whatever little breaks I get, I enjoy reading your guys’ stuff. But you have brought a very piquant topic to discuss and I have very strong views about conundrum style of writing. There’s a difference between saying “it gets late very early this time of the year”, and “days are long in summer”. What Manto has done (in a nutshell) is tried to twist the reader’s mind and he takes one to the journey where the only thing that dares to venture is one’s mind. I appreciate such writing style. Profanities (or porno) are really only part of expressing one’s exacerbation with society and juicy details are really not the gross of the message that he tries to get across. It is about visionary and intellective stimulation, something that penetrates deep and often hurts.

[NeSCio]

Originally posted by Sadi Sobi:

I agree utterly with Manto (even tho i've never read his stuff). I've learnt that the only person that u can trust in life is mans best friend - his soul.

I thought man's best friend was his DOG!!!

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Everybody wants to go to heaven, but nobody wants to die.

[confused]

*scratches head* .. thanda gosht, that was one of the very hot disputed issues that i came across too .. people DID proved it both a good one and a bad one .. depends how u look at it.. whether its explicit or not, thats up to the reader.. i personally found it quiet powerful material for pointing out society's issues..

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Never frown, even when your are sad,because you never know who is falling in love with your smile.

[Muzna]

Is it necessary to be explicit to express societal issues?

Why can't it be done with finesse?

[isloo_ki_anarkali]

Originally posted by Muzna:
Is it necessary to be explicit to express societal issues?
Why can't it be done with finesse?

yes....because sometimes to be heard you have to be louder than the noise in your audience's head!

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'.......I always knew looking back on the tears
would make me laugh...
But i never knew looking back on the laughs would
make me cry......'

[This message has been edited by isloo_ki_anarkali (edited April 04, 2001).]

[NYAhmadiX]

Muzna. Considering that he died of over-drinking at the age of 41, it is a marvel that he left us with such a tremendous gift – the gift of his writings. If you get a chance, read Manto Nama – a collection of his short stories and you be the judge for yourself. The bullsh1t about profanities is only half the story, the other half is the underlying message. We can’t expect all writers to be the same. It is only in our minds what limits the way we acknowledge/receive or dispense information. Manto has gotten equal number of bad reviews for his writing as he has good ones (he was sued a number of times, and was also jailed on more than a few occasions). Most would agree that he was way ahead of his times. I personally think that he is way ahead of even our times. Whenever I re-read his stories (which I have been doing for the past 20 years) it is always something new that I discover, either about my own self or about something indistinct.

[Why Me!]

It is true that there r lot of things inside every person that he does not speak about.

But this attitude that we should speak everything that comes to our mind or heart, is not right. It is very known fact that every person is a mixture of Good and Bad and there is one thing called "Nafas" which is the source of bad thinkings and behaviours in any human so everything that comes to ur mind or heart is not necessorily good. U should not speak about such things, cause such things are not gonna do any good to society.

So think before u speak.

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Anything goes wrong, I am held responsible

[Mr Xtreme]

I don’t know. It’s hard to judge something that you haven’t read yourself so there’s not much point in trying. The consensus seems to be that Manto’s writings were more about social deprivation and if that’s the case, I would go along with that. There is a big difference between stuff that is written for titillation and stuff that is pointing at hypocrisy in society.

Reminds me of when I went to see Ataullah Isakhelvi in concert. Some of his songs have really nice shairi in them, especially I liked one called “ishq mein, main tumhai kya bataaieN”. Ataullah has a pretty colourful history but that wasn’t my concern, I was going to hear him sing. But during the show, he had some dancer come on stage wearing a veil over her head but glitzy clothes otherwise and she proceeded to do a provocative dance in front of an audience of Pakistanis. Possibly because he was in the UK he felt he could get away with it, I doubt he could have done it in Pakistan. But to me, that was crossing the line. It was just plain ugly and there was no need for it. This is the other side of the coin.

On the wider issue, Muzna pointed out that some things are better left unsaid. I think there are cases when that is definitely true.